charter peanut gallery

Discussion in 'The Undercity' started by seebs, Feb 22, 2017.

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  1. seebs

    seebs Benevolent Dictator

    So I know people can't not argue and discuss and stuff. And I am happy with that. It is part of the purpose of the forum to admit such things. But I want the charter thread itself to just be the statement of the thing. But if you want to chatter about it, feel free.
  2. jacktrash

    jacktrash spherical sockbox

    ERRRRT stop the power trip bus this is where you get off


    on every forum i've ever been on, there has always been a small contingent of sassy little martinets agitating against the forum's owner(s) and mods, as if the place is a town and they're running for mayor on a mud-slinging and scandal-mongering platform. some places shut this behavior down with bans; it just makes the problem worse, in the long run, because it comes across as tyrannical. besides, around here we have this no-ban policy, so it looks to you like we're sitting ducks and you can do whatever you want, right?

    well, guess what. i had to come back from medical leave to deal with your bullshit because my beloved seebs was literally wringing their hands in panic and distress over the way you've been hurting and scaring some of the most vulnerable members of this forum, and i am very. fucking. angry.

    no, we're not going to ban you. we don't ban members with BPD for having meltdowns. we don't ban members with ASPD for playing shitty mindgames. and we don't ban people with whatever your goddamn problem is for trying to create cyber coventry out of tinker toys and spite.

    but from here on out, i will be watching you and i will be weighing in. every motherfucking time you talk smack about seebs, about me, about other mods, about vulnerable people, whether you're namedropping or vaguing, i will be there, and i will drop a great big bear turd in your cereal bowl and i invite you to tell me what the hell you think you can do about it.

    you want to freeze out serial abusers? start with yourself, pal. but you're on your own with that. you will never, ever have buy-in from forum administration for that crap.

    this is not a democracy. this is forum software run on hardware in our house, paid for from our joint bank account. no matter how much you soapbox, you will not be elected seebs. no matter how much you disagree with the fundamental purpose of this forum, it will not change.

    so you can dial back the power trip and learn to use the ignore function like everyone else, or you can deal with how my personality gets when i'm strung out and exhausted, with sores under my tongue, balloon hands, constipation, and broken glass for a spine. fuck you so much for making me do this.
    • Like x 8
  3. wixbloom

    wixbloom artcute

    Jesse, I've stayed out of this entire shitstorm so far and Lord help me but I'll duck out as soon as I say this, but this is a really unfair amount of retribution to Wiwaxia, who has not suicide-baited or harassed anyone in the way "the most vulnerable members of this forum" have. I absolutely agree with a no-ban moderation policy and generally disagree with Wax, but this response reeks of personal vendetta and is absurd, and unfair, and accusing Wax of being a serial abuser is beyond the pale. I really think you should retract that accusation.
    • Like x 22
  4. wixbloom

    wixbloom artcute

    You also seem to be letting your urge to defend your spouse get the better of you, and while that's absolutely understandable and in your shoes I'd do the same, this is not how you deal with it. Please, both of you, take a break. Comfort seebs in other ways that are not related to singling out and targeting Wax. There's other mods. Nobody is trying to replace seebs.
    • Like x 11
  5. jacktrash

    jacktrash spherical sockbox

    nnnnope. this isn't about whose 'crime' is worst. i don't have to solve the Problem Of Drama before i get mad at wax for trying to organize a mob against the fundamental purpose of the forum.

    i mean, your arguments are noted, but nope.
    • Like x 1
  6. wixbloom

    wixbloom artcute


    what... makes you think they're trying to organize a mob??
    • Like x 3
  7. wixbloom

    wixbloom artcute

    Wax has a dissenting opinion which they chose to voice, and you're choosing to single them out for it in what strikes me as a very violent way. I will respect your argument and avoid comparisons with how other drama was dealt with, because I agree with you there, you don't have to have solved every issue before you have the right to address one that bugs you. But take a moment to note the kind of accusatory language you are using, as if Wax is maliciously staging a coup of the forum.
    • Like x 11
  8. BlackholeKG

    BlackholeKG I saw you making fire



    A week back we had targeted sexual abuse, cyberstalking, threatening of users with revenge porn, targeting of a forum member's niece, and this is where the forum moderation is taking its stand? Seebs doesn't even bother to address Michi after what HFS did to her, and yet the whole forum gets frozen for the day so you can paint a target on Wiwaxia for saying that they don't intend to welcome or interact with serial abusers in the community and that saying that others might want to do the same?

    Guess what, I feel like that's a fairly reasonable decision for somebody to be able to make, and its not like anyone is... obligated to do the same. This is... pretty much just a choice that Wiwaxia is making, and one that while I don't agree with, I can certainly empathize with.

    I don't believe that evil really exists as a coherent thing in the world, but insofar as the word is applicable to any situation as a descriptor, I think that some of what HFS did to Michi certainly qualifies. Yes, this is a place for recovery, but just because somebody has a mental illness does not mean that we have to collectively agree to tolerate their abuse. Furthermore, I sorta can't believe that while said abusers go what amounts to a slap on the wrist, forum moderation is now going all out on Wiwaxia, seemingly due to Seebs' pre-existing dislike for them. Did the forum go offline when HFS was telling users about how they wanted to, what was it, "eat the cheese out of their fat rolls"? When they were engaging in their targeted campaign of misogynistic abuse? No?

    I think priorities might be a little backwards, here.

    Fuck, I'm tired of this.
    • Like x 13
  9. jacktrash

    jacktrash spherical sockbox

    if you want to go somewhere that socially acceptable speech is prioritized, you have a whooooole lotta options, fam.
  10. BlackholeKG

    BlackholeKG I saw you making fire

    This is fucking telling. "We don't ban here" has been a flag that Seebs has be waving through hell and high water. An unquestioned fact that they held fast to even when members were engaging in pretty much the most abhorrent kind of speech that a person is capable of engaging in. While users were inciting suicide.

    And yet this, of all things, is what makes Seebs have to be "convinced with difficulty" not to ban a user.

    Bias what?
    • Like x 12
  11. jacktrash

    jacktrash spherical sockbox

    just to be clear, "but someone else did worse!" is not gonna fly with me at this time.

    wax has been campaigning like a texas senator on every social media platform they have, and it's been going on for months. and i'm mad as hell.

    you wanna try talking me out of being mad and saying so, have fun with that. i mean, good effort. *confetti*
  12. BlackholeKG

    BlackholeKG I saw you making fire

    "No, no, see, it wasn't abuse, it was just 'socially unacceptable speech'!"

    • Like x 7
  13. TheSeer

    TheSeer 37 Bright Visionary Crushes The Doubtful

    Wiwaxia's my forum buddy, but folks, read that top quote. That was not just talking about a personal choice, that was a pretty overt attempt to organize a community action. ("I'd encourage anyone reading to do the same," "hopefully a broad enough base of people," "this site's overton window needs a hard kick.") It seems really disingenous to talk about that like it's purely personal and not political at all. If you want to support them, support them; don't misrepresent what they were trying to do.

    ETA: Might it be possible and advisable to disable likes on this thread? The like function seems like it might have issues here for the same reasons as in the "That could have gone better" subforum.
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2017
    • Like x 17
  14. jacktrash

    jacktrash spherical sockbox

    really? "you are making it really fucking hard to stick to our no-ban policy" says bad things about seebs, not about the person pushing the envelope to find out how many people they can drive off the fucking forum?
    • Like x 1
  15. wixbloom

    wixbloom artcute

    I'm really making an effort to be respectful of what you say and consider your arguments and it's clearly a one-sided effort. Since I'm not up to getting strawmanned, and since I do, in fact, want to go somewhere where mutual respect is prioritized, I'm stepping out of this conversation before I get mad enough to start talking to you the way you're talking to me.

    EDIT: and to others

    EDIT 2: I had typed "a one-sided effect" rather than "a one-sided effort", and have edited to fix that typo.
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2017
    • Like x 9
  16. paintcat

    paintcat Let the voice of love take you higher

    I don't think this is about "but someone else did worse" per se. I think Josie is trying to point out that the disparity of responses kinda points out something worrisome about site administration's priorities at this time.
    • Like x 14
  17. BlackholeKG

    BlackholeKG I saw you making fire

    If you're mad then I'd recommend taking a few hours to cool off and not making personal grudges forum moderation policy.

    Because holy strawmanning, Batman, these are not level-headed accusations.
    • Like x 11
  18. jacktrash

    jacktrash spherical sockbox

    the site's administration priorities AT ALL TIMES are that even people who say horrible shit are not banned.

    other solutions are sought. they may or may not work.

    this has been the case from day one. y'all need to stop acting surprised about it. seriously.
    • Like x 1
  19. BlackholeKG

    BlackholeKG I saw you making fire

    • Like x 5
  20. jacktrash

    jacktrash spherical sockbox

    heeeey how about telling me where i made forum moderation policy. cuz that didn't happen.
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