charter peanut gallery

Discussion in 'The Undercity' started by seebs, Feb 22, 2017.

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  1. AbsenteeLandlady123

    AbsenteeLandlady123 Chronically screaming

    Personally I disagree there (note, not at all mad or upset at you for having a different opinion, just offering personal perspective)

    Sometimes I know I compartmentalize like a mofo because I can't deal with a thing Right Now. This results in memory loss, which is why I am very glad most of my interactions are in text now so I can go back and read over things later. Post meltdown, if I have said or done something I worry I will hurt others, immediately confronting myself with that is very likely to trigger a secondary meltdown, but an apology spiral this time.

    That isn't helpful at all, so I will make a sort of catch all apology and then return to specify things when I am stable and not worried I will turn my apology into needing people to reassure me. So in that way, not processing the thing immediately after very much is trying to get better, because it is mitigating further harm, if that makes sense?
     
    • Like x 13
  2. evilas

    evilas Sure, I'll put a custom title here

    I think starting from what we know is a good way to solve these kinds of discussions. And the simpler we can make it the better. So I did a thing.
     
    • Like x 10
  3. AbsenteeLandlady123

    AbsenteeLandlady123 Chronically screaming

    An excellent thing, thank you for this good thing
     
    • Like x 4
  4. prismaticvoid

    prismaticvoid Too Too Abstract

    Yeah, I don't think you need to process immediately if it will trigger you further, and I apologize for not being specific. It just helps to say "hey, I can't deal with this right now, but I will later" and try to be clear about when you think that will be possible.
     
    • Like x 6
  5. AbsenteeLandlady123

    AbsenteeLandlady123 Chronically screaming

    I absolutely agree with that. It's a hard thing to be able to say because not everyone has reached the level of...not sure how to describe aside from 'active recognition of their cognition patterns' which sounds condescending as hell, but especially for people who have been unable to seek out help before for whatever reason, it might not be a pattern they recognize yet. I'm absolutely happy to help anybody reading this who has that problem.
     
    • Like x 3
  6. AbsenteeLandLady124

    AbsenteeLandLady124 Well-Known Member

    Important edit: before, here-

    I put things in quotation marks because I thought I was quoting an earlier message, I was not. Document messed up my formatting, and the conversation itself is super difficult for me to follow, so here's a visual Capture.PNG
     
    • Like x 2
  7. thegrimsqueaker

    thegrimsqueaker 28 Moribunding Mouse Aggravates the Angry Assholes

    think of it like this: your husband says "if you say a word I don't like I will be there to hound you and mock you and drag you down into ever mud puddle I can find" and then you post a thing that says "oh, but of course you're welcome here."

    what I hear from that is that Wax is welcome... to say nothing w/o Jesse's approval

    I rly don't want to get into what Wax said that started this shit. I don't want to read the history of txt walls between the two of you. leave me out of that, please

    but I didn't say those platitudes were false. I said I felt creeped out by them, bc they can be absolutely sincere while still not contradicting what your spouse said. it's exactly the kind of CYA bs that will always creep me out bc I spent my entire childhood dealing w it. "you're welcome in this house, so long as you clean everything and get perfect grades and have dinner on the table at 7." "we want you to be part of our community, so long as you never talk about anything that happened before you came here." "family means you always have a place to go, until you push too far and then you're out on your ass."

    I never said a word about your welcome being false. it doesn't have to be a lie to be creepy
    you keep saying this, but you've yet to give evidence beyond the initial post in Wax's vent thread (pls don't quote that at me when you respond, I don't want to get involved in that)

    edit: typos
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2017
    • Like x 5
  8. rigorist

    rigorist On the beach

    If Staff is to be committed to a policy of radical hospitality, they would do well to avoid vulgar threats of stalking and harassment which have the foreseeable result of driving people off the forum.

    All this talk of "shunning" so far has really been a red herring to divert our attention from the original OP. It is an attempt to avoid blame for the actions of Staff. Let us be very clear here: the people who have driven others off the forum have been the Staff of the forum. Until they actually admit they have done that, this thread will continue to be an embarrassment.
     
    • Like x 7
  9. AbsenteeLandLady124

    AbsenteeLandLady124 Well-Known Member

    that...happened though, didn't it? Am I remembering wrong?

    I disagree with your categorizing it as a red herring because people have been hurt pretty badly by both things.
     
    • Like x 5
  10. AbsenteeLandlady123

    AbsenteeLandlady123 Chronically screaming

    no that definitely did happen, because of the Welcome post and subsequent posts here after the break, and I worked with seebs and quoted things while the break was happening - what more do you want? I'm asking sincerely, because I have pretty severe memory issues and this is starting to fuck with me to the point where I can't function.
    Also the one person directly targeted by the original OP has every intent of returning in the next few days, which I should have mentioned earlier, but I'm tired.
     
    • Like x 2
  11. thegrimsqueaker

    thegrimsqueaker 28 Moribunding Mouse Aggravates the Angry Assholes

    I'm confused- what are you asking about?
     
  12. rigorist

    rigorist On the beach

    It may have been buried in a WOT. Well-covered in extra words so we couldn't see it clearly.

    Cool. Everybody is welcome on Tiki Beach. We're going to build a waterslide out of walls of text.
     
    • Like x 2
  13. Snitchanon

    Snitchanon What's a mod to a nonbeliever.

    Official staff lines have said that the OP was unacceptable and acknowledged the harm caused.
     
    • Like x 6
  14. AbsenteeLandlady123

    AbsenteeLandlady123 Chronically screaming

    acknowledged that it hurt people and wasn't okay
     
  15. leo

    leo Well-Known Member

    I think Rigs might have meant from Jesse specifically, with an apology.
     
    • Like x 3
  16. seebs

    seebs Benevolent Dictator

    This has been repeatedly and directly acknowledged in this thread and others.

    No, it hasn't. The only attempt to divert attention from that was merging the thread into another thread precisely because that OP was angry, shouty, and unproductive, and did not merit its own thread. In short, because people said they were uncomfortable with a thread starting with that.

    It is not.

    This is substantively false, because the use of the definite article strongly implies that no non-staff have driven anyone off the forum, and that's simply not true.

    It is absolutely agreed that both Jesse and I have, on multiple occasions, behaved poorly in ways that have caused people to leave the forums. But let us also be clear: Staff are in a distant third or fourth place at driving people off the forums, and if we want to be known as the people who have driven others off the forum, we are gonna have to step up our game. Which we are disinclined to do.

    Objection, asked and answered: We've already admitted that several times, agreed that Jesse's angry shouty post did not reflect our ideals, and so on. We've gone over this lots, and it's not disputed, and we're not trying to avoid blame for it. We acknowledged it, and I made a counterpoint thread specifically because I feel that it was unfair to Wiwaxia to have an admin-started thread shouting at Wiwaxia about things, and I felt the correct counterpoint was to put in a thread explicitly asserting the contrary point.

    ... But that doesn't change the rest of the context.

    It makes sense to say "we need to have an admission of fault on the part of the admins", or at least, it made sense before the admin had posted the admission of fault. What doesn't make sense, to me, is coming back to it again after that already happened, and/or using it as a distraction from a problem that's been happening far longer, has affected a larger number of people, continues to happen, and for which there have been no apologies or admissions or anything.

    Yes, Jesse lost his temper, as sometimes happens. It was sorta fucked up and he was angry and not expressing his position very well at all in some respects. But "this reaction is too angry and too mean" does not imply "the thing you were reacting to was in no way bad".
     
    • Like x 5
  17. seebs

    seebs Benevolent Dictator

    Jesse is very unlikely to resume posting outside of dire emergencies until he can go an entire hour without significant pain. "Seebs already acknowledged and apologized for the thing, but it didn't actually come from Jesse's account" is not, I think, a dire emergency.
     
    • Like x 3
  18. seebs

    seebs Benevolent Dictator

    [and back on break]
     
    • Like x 1
  19. leo

    leo Well-Known Member

    Seebs, your response is fine up until the placement of chasing people off the forums. Are you sure you've cooled off enough?
     
    • Like x 1
  20. AbsenteeLandLady124

    AbsenteeLandLady124 Well-Known Member

    Jesse is ill and in agony and that can wait until he can function as a human being, and until that's the case the situation is as resolved as it can be on that front

    im not mad at you leo or anything everything is just really confusing for me right now and i don't trust my understanding of reality
     
    • Like x 7
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