siiiiiiiiiiiiiigh someday someone will explain the difference between us

I apologize for misreading the topic.

 

Thanks. I'm glad you had a place to ask your question and get it answered.

 

would you mind putting that analogy that mentioned rape under a labeled spoiler? thanks!

 

The caps and long, unbroken paragraphs made it difficult to understand what you're saying. Can you tl;dr this for me?

 

i stayed out of this conversation while it started but i do want to say one thing:

if bpd made sense, or was logical, none of this would be a fucking problem. but because it isn't, and because it doesn't make sense, and because it isn't logical, it is often difficult for people who do not have bpd to understand why people want to base an identity around the only thing that will ever seem constant about you: the fact that your identity is mutable because of this personality disorder that is also part of what should be your sense of self, which is itself missing due to the personality disorder.

@sunsetbreezes i feel like you're approaching this topic from the point of view of "why won't these people make sense according to what i would do?" the entire point is that people with bpd have a personality disorder, and personality disorders do not make sense, and are not logical, just like any other kind of mental illness.

you're also treating our experiences like they're objective truths instead of beliefs that (for the most part we ourselves have the ability to recognize) are illogical. the thing i've also seen you do in here is have someone with bpd explain why they're uncomfortable, then you turn around and say "but what's the real reason tho."

this was probably not the best way for you to start this thread. remember, you're asking the opinion of people with a personality disorder that causes them to wear their emotions on the surface at all times and be extra-sensitive to even the lightest potential slight. what's ironic is that you're splitting about this.

it's really sounding to me, throughout the thread, like you fundamentally do not understand the symptoms of bpd. because, i will admit, there are "relatable bpd" posts, which are not the symptoms, but without a real thorough grounding in what the symptoms are, and how they can manifest, and how they feel to the patient, you're not going to understand why these posts are particularly relatable to bpders. not everyone with a given symptom will meet the diagnostic threshold for bpd, which means that some things that are under, say, impulsive behavior/impulse control (which i don't have problems with), which is among the diagnostic criteria, will be relatable to a good chunk of people with bpd, and some people with other pds or mental illnesses or even neurotypical people. however, when these posts are made by bpders specifically as relatable bpd things, it's because of the other diagnostic criteria in the background that they're so particularly relatable.

because of the missing-sense-of-self replacing-with-the-one-part-of-the-personality-that-will-never-change-because-it's-a-disorder issue, there is a large potential of harm here that is very easily avoided by simply not doing the thing. if the tradeoff is pros vs. cons, the people in this thread with bpd have specifically told you that there are more cons than pros for people with bpd when you do the thing, and what you've said has kind of come across to me as "what about me tho."

i understand that you are frustrated. because bpd is a constellation of symptoms that correlate to a diagnostic criteria and it's a majority thing on whether you get diagnosed or not, often individual stars from the constellation seem bright and visible, and it seems like you personally relate to a lot of them. but people have already told you that there is a constellation there that you're missing for the star, a forest you're missing for the tree, and the post is for the constellation/forest, not specifically for the star/tree, even though it can obviously focus on only one star/tree at once. this, i think, is what @MayaaFeys was trying to get at with the "you will never understand" language, because there is a rich context here. and from what you've displayed here, there's only three options i can ascribe to your behavior: 1) unfamiliarity with/lack of knowledge of bpd, its constellation of symptoms, and how they manifest in a particular patient (if so, please see this thread on this forum, just started recently to start answering questions to help with some of the informing); 2) genuine misunderstanding of the knowledge and familiarity you have with bpd, its constellation of symptoms, and how they manifest in a particular patient (see thread mentioned, will help with this); or 3) not actually caring about any of this, wanting to do the thing anyway, starting a fight with people who as a category have boundary problems, and then ignoring their explanation when they say how it hurts them because it doesn't make sense to you, maintaining instead that you still want to do a thing that hurts them.

so, what you're doing is frustrating me as well. i would really advise you to listen to others' perspectives on this, instead of just looking for The One Reason. i tend to think it's better to listen when people tell you what you're doing is harming them, especially when you doing something that's harming them can be totally avoided.

edited to add link and a word

 

whoops, coming back to wonder why you chose this post for an example in your original post. is it because all of them seem particularly extreme to you, as an explanation of the symptoms found in the icd/dsm? because bpd, like i said above, doesn't fucking make sense and isn't fucking logical. if you're trying to mock people with bpd by using this post, you're doing this wrong, because those are literal ways in which the dsm/icd criteria present themselves in patients.

or is it because you want to reblog this post and find it relatable? because if you find like 2/3 of the bullet points up there relatable enough to reblog, there's something in your brain that needs to be evaluated by a medical professional, because relating that strongly to this post strongly indicates that you actually have bpd, since these are iterations of the actual diagnostic criteria.

 

@baskerville tired rn from typing the below to pix, maybe tomorrow, sorry about that

@pixels what would, if it happened, make you think you'd accomplished what you wanted to accomplish with that post? What actions would make you think "yes, I convinced S to do what I wanted" if I did them? What do you think I'm doing that's harming others and can totally be avoided? What "thing" do you think I might want do "do anyway" and be starting a fight over? Why do you think you can say I'm splitting when splitting is a BPD thing? What evidence, even if you don't think that evidence would ever happen, would convince you I know what I'm talking about and also don't just want to hurt people for fun?

This is when I spotted your next message. Previous paragraph: reply to first message, did not see second message. Next paragraphs: reply to second message.

Spoiler: cut just for talking about my personal mental health and stuff

There are thirteen things on that list and I'm going to break my reactins to them down into categories without listing the specific items.
1. Things I literally do, literally: 4 things
2. Things that sound a lot like things I would do if I had the same problems I have but a slightly, not very, different personality, that aren't more severe than problems I have but are just slightly different either because I react that way to a situation that's equally bad but different or because I react that strongly but with a different negative emotion, basically, things I can totally understand doing that I would do in the universe next door or did do in the past: 5 things
3. Things I do, but not that extremely: 1 thing
4. Things I have done, literally like that, but not very often: 1 thing
5. Things I don't really do that don't sound like me much at all: 2 things

To clarify that second category, things I either did before or could've done in another universe, just as an example that might be in it or I might have made it all up, I don't want to be too specific in talking about why I find this list relatable, maybe I don't feel suicidal because someone doesn't text me back because I don't text or maybe I don't want to kill my best friend's other friends because I blame myself for not being more worthy than that other friend instead. Or maybe those aren't two of the things in that category and it's different points in that category.

But the time before cA saying it, a few months ago, I talked to someone when I was having a hard time before I decided to go see a shrink again, I wasn't even sure what was up, they tossed out a few ideas, I mentioned all their ideas to my shrink as well as a lot of information about how I felt and what was wrong right then. That was sort of important because one of the possibilities that had come up had a very bad prognosis compared to all the others, and I knew that three of them had different treatments and I didn't know anything about treating two of them, so I did need to bring up all those possibilities to ask if that was likely and not just talk about symptoms. The shrink thought one idea was worrying too much about a more minor problem that wouldn't get worse, unlike the similar-seeming version that's very serious. They didn't really comment on two of them as possible diagnoses but talked about how to deal with the symptoms I had that made me think they were plausible, which included one of the ones I didn't know anything about treatment for before. They implied that I did clearly have one of them and talked about what we could do to treat it. And they dismissed BPD out of hand as a possibility in one sentence.

I wanted to explain what my problems were so they could help me fix them and I also wanted to quickly explain why those specific five conditions were of interest to me. I also didn't want to forget anything and I wanted to stop constantly rehearsing everything in my head all the time. So I found some DSM-based symptom checklists and some people writing about their experiences. I printed them all out and highlighted everything that was true of me. That meant two things. The first is that the shrink, at the time of dismissing BPD as a possibility, had my highlighted notes including a marked-up copy of this checklist of BPD symptoms in their hands. The other thing is that even before I went I could see some things and start to make some more educated guesses than just that list of five maybes. I was less worried because the very dangerous one that could get much worse had a lot of circumstantial evidence going for it but the required criteria were almost totally not true of me. Seeing all that unhighlighted white space on the worst page was a relief, it was pretty clear I would have to be very wrong about myself to have that one. So I went through the BPD criteria and there were a lot highlighted but not enough. I would have to be wrong about not meeting multiple different ones to still have it. I could be wrong, I know, I'm not the professional. Then again I think this professional might be one of the ones who's not very good about BPD. But I also did other research, like reading some posts on tumblr and listening to all of these videos and reading a book and a non-tumblr blog and the parts of some books that I could preview on Amazon because the library didn't have them, and I think I don't have it. cA's comments make me wonder again, because I never had someone who had it say I ping them that way before, but I still think there was probably no time when I actually had enough criteria at the same time to be diagnosed. cA brings up the possibility of having had it before without knowing. It's interesting and I'm thinking about it and I can definitely understand why cA and now you would wonder. I guess if what I cared about is convincing specific people that I have a right to say specific words then I could do that just by saying some true things about my issues. But I'm still not convinced for a few reasons. For instance there's one thing I've never heard of anyone who had BPD and didn't have but that I don't have.

That's the answer to the question I think you wanted to ask. The answer to the question of why I chose that post as my example is because basically the following thing happened: I was reading tumblr and was sort of skimming, so I sort of parsed it as "relatable BPD content: like three of the things that I happened to see before scrolling down" and was like "haha gpoy" and went and read the list more carefully and then noticed that the beginning was sarcastic. It's probably meant to come off like "you want relatable? I'll give you relatable!" like daring someone to treat it like a funny relatable feels post. And that's why finding it was the thing that made me want to make the thread.

Oh. I do want to say some more things about your first post.

What?

Why do you think that's wrong? I think I can guess but you didn't say and I don't want to answer something you're not saying.

I also get the idea, maybe I'm wrong, that you might have just written ten paragraphs of text taking a strong position about a thread you only skimmed without really reading most of. If that's true could you mention it? Just so I know to go find a couple of quotes so you don't have to read everything looking for them! :)

 

This miiiiight be my last post on this forum because I think I've probably done what I was called here for and this is just ugh. I'm out. But answering this because Beldaran is very nice.

Spoiler: long

Hey.

Oops. Figured it was too common to worry about especially when people answered saying they knew exactly what I was talking about and wanted to defend it.

OK... Sounds fake but OK

I know. I never said I didn't. That is why I relate so hard to the posts I mentioned.

One of the times I said I was being as impartial as possible I meant it sarcastically. Or something. Not quite sarcastically. But "lol that's as fair and impartial as I can be rn" is a joke and the punchline is that that's pathetic.

That's why "This is not my calm opinion:" is the sentence right before it.

Which things are you refering to here? Not that I don't know I'm upset and could say things better if I weren't upset, which is noooooooot really useful to know, but which things sound how bad from your point of view?

Nice of you to think I meant to be helpful. I was actually trying to point out that "it upsets me if people say it" and "it can't be true" aren't the same thing because what I feel only counts if those things aren't the same. So it's very convenient for me that they're not. Maybe I'm the only one here stupid enough not to know that without someone else saying it.

Thanks for all the mental health advice. I'll see if any of it's helpful. <> It's very kind of you to try to help me even though all I've done is upset everyone.

 

if i said "you're not allowed to relate to bpd ever ever ever" im sorry i didnt mean to

 

I do know this place's history too well to believe that. Besides which I don't see any reason to stay if people's attitude to me is going to be just tolerating the crazy out of pity. I'm done, except answering you, and I stand by that.

Thanks.

I thought posting in one of the forums labeled as being for advice/analysis/argumentation and not specifically asking any particular person to say anything would lead to people not answering if having anything to do with me would give them horrible panic spirals that they can't possibly deal with. I didn't know saying something where anyone could choose to engage or not was the same thing as going up to a specific person and demanding they respond.

Wasn't aware posting something in public was the same as knocking down someone's door. Can't tell why that logic doesn't mean that the posts I'm upset about were knocking down my door, especially since I put this in a place where people could know it was going to be a heavy post about mental health issues and the post that was the last straw in getting me to say something was on a blog I followed for the heathen religious content.

I don't know if I'm going to answer again if you respond to this or not. I might just decide that's enough lingering in this thread when I already said I'm leaving. If you say something and don't get an answer then that's why.

 

Definitely the last thing I'm going to say here now but this finally clicked for me. This conversation: a dramatization by me.

The tumblr posts I was talking about: you can't possibly understand this feeling, if you say you do you're lying or mistaken, which is why reblogging this post would be objectively immoral and objectively not true
The tumblr posts everyone else here thinks I'm talking about, that I've never seen but I'll believe exist: please don't reblog this, it makes me feel uncomfortable

Me: you're not objectively right about my feelings and you're not saying true correct things that stand up to logical argument and make sense as statements about objective facts and morality, why do people keep saying these things that aren't actually right?
You: well here are my reasons for feeling uncomfortable if someone does this
Me: but those reasons are unreasonable and they're based on irrational feelings! That's not a good basis for talking about objective truth and morality!
You: why are you so angry that I have irrational feelings? Why can't you be nice to people who have irrational feelings? Why do you think I'm doing something bad just by having problems I can't help? Why are you literally trying to argue with me about my mental illness?
Me: WHY ARE YOU PUTTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH OMG STOP SAYING I SAID THINGS I NEVER SAID! WHY DO YOU THINK BEING IRRATIONAL IS A GOOD BASIS FOR TALKING ABOUT WHAT'S OBJECTIVELY TRUE? ALL I WANT TO DO IS BE ALLOWED TO HAVE FEELINGS WITHOUT BEING TOLD THEY'RE OBJECTIVELY WRONG!
You: why do you insist on doing the thing you're doing? The thing you're doing is hurting people. Stop it.

Me: remembering this place exists is nauseating and everyone thinks I'm stupid now anyway so I'm out. I just wanted to say this first.

In hindsight I had the first chance to notice something was wrong within the first three posts. That's just granting that I was assuming everyone would know I was talking about the thing I see all the time and not the thing I've never seen, ever, not even once. Just granting that I couldn't have guessed I needed to make that clear. I could have guessed from MF's first post that they weren't talking about it. But Maya's answer was that no I really couldn't possibly understand, that really is factually true, here are some examples of things you only think you experience that you really don't. After that there hasn't been a single time I could read Kintsugi without a fight or flight reaction and nothing I said was very nice. I'm still angry that I did say three different times that I wasn't talking about what anyone thought I was talking about and no one except Bel even noticed and tbh until seeing that Pix liked Bel's post I wasn't sure if "you have evil wrong feelings" was the thing they were telling me to stop doing because it was hurting people or if no one was listening to anything I was saying and nothing I could do would ever communicate anything at all.

This isn't your cue to hug it out with me. I wouldn't even want to try to do that. But if it's useful to you. Or if it's interesting! Or anything. There you go. Goodbye. This time I'm not going to stick around answering replies. I don't hate anyone involved and I think you all have hurt feelings, which is terrible and I'm sorry that it happened and I'm sorry that I didn't read MF's post carefully enough to figure out what the problem was sooner. I guess I'm not the only one who literally said the important thing explicitly and had it completely ignored. I'm not even the first. I am the one who said it three times, once in capslock, and had it ignored by lots of different people but I'm not the only one and I'm not the first and I did exactly what I'm angry at everyone here for. I'm sorry that I did that. But I don't ever want to have anything to do with Kintsugi again. This was way too painful and I hadn't been here long enough to have any positive associations to really balance it out. And I didn't ever plan on staying here, I just needed a place to put some thoughts I had and needed to share and started reading things and answering since I was already here.

But I don't regret visiting. I regret nothing. It was a great visit, including that last part. I like you all.

 

Fine, one more response.

Right. Before I saw Pix like that, so implicitly agree with that, I thought Pix might have meant "stop having feelings" because they were telling me to stop something unspecified after I said the thing I was doing was having feelings. Because you managed to read what I actually wrote and Pix liked that, as opposde to arguing that you're wrong, I can tell what Pix meant. So now I can tell that Pix wasn't saying that they want me to stop having feelings or thinking I have feelings or something, because if they had thought that then they wouldn't have liked your post. Because your post was very clear about that.

I just can't seem to communicate clearly with anyone here at all! And that's another reason to quit but I want to clear the confusion up first.

But anyway I also want to thank you for stepping into this.

 

I can't figure out why you would make that invitation. Do you want to talk to me? Do you just think I don't deserve to be a l o n e f o r e v e r and want to be my pity-friend? Is it something else? Is there something I can do for you? I'm confused.

 

i think the main problem is that all of us are clearly seeing different manifestations of the situation. a lot of ya'll are saying you're seeing people just reblog the relatable feels cause they are probably bpd or bpd traits but i'm seeing things like

"i want to die cause my fp hasn't texted me back in 25 minutes and left me on a read receipt"
"lol same!!! i need attention :)"
"no like. im actually suicidal right now. they hate me clearly and i did something wrong and i want to kill myself."
"well that's just unreasonable stop feeling like that you freak =/"