Posted this earlier in the thread not long after my own adventures in the Vault, so here I am sharing it with everyone because I'm a helper. (Not my screenshot, FTR.) Spoiler: "Sure dude, whatever you say. I doubt that'll ever be relevant to my life."
Dark Knight story is REALLY GOOD, as I've probably said every time it comes up, haha... While we're commiserating: Spoiler I ended up associating this song with WoL/Haurchefant and now whenever Spotify plays it i get weepy ;_; Also Spoiler: minor spoilers for the end of 3.0, tho its probably obvious that it'll happen Every time I get that fight in trial roulette and Zephirin appears I STILL pop every cooldown I have on hand and hiss "Get WRECKEDDDDDD." Edit: I will say that, while unfortunately you can't affect the story itself much, you do get more dialogue choices from there on, especially though the 3.x patches. I appreciated that.
Also, @Akiv'a pointed out once that Lucia is basically Natalie Dormer's face on Gwen Christie's body and now I cannot unsee. (Not that there's a problem with that AT ALL.)
Speaking of Zephirin... Spoiler: 3.0 shit I've been reading a whole lot of stuff along the lines of 'THE HEAVEN'S WARD DID NOTHING WRONG!!!' (ha) and it all seems to revolve around the idea that Thordan either threatened to or succeeded in tempering/blessing them. Lots of statements along the lines of 'he succeeded and that's canon, you can't argue otherwise' when (last I checked, anyway), it's more ambiguous about what went down? I mean, we know for sure that Zephirin had some misgivings about... basically the entire situation, but I don't think that necessarily translates to threats of or successful blessing given the dynamics of the Ishgardian social/religious system. Does anyone know where this is coming from? Is it just the one cutscene with him and Thordan chatting where he transforms into tin man at the end? Does the tin man transformation necessitate being blessed? Could Thordan have blessed anyone before his transformation in Azys Lla? For that matter, how did those guys go tin man without the whole primal Thordan shit? Was he capable of transforming before the Singularity Reactor using the second Eye, just with much less power (due to the lack of Warring Triad), or no? Where'd their power come from? Ugh. I really need to replay all of this shit. I hate not knowing if people defending Zephirin and the rest of the HW are correct or they're just interpreting shit in the best way possible to get him a get out of murder free card because they think he's cool. Serious misgivings about a situation doesn't mean he had to be brainwashed into going along with it, especially when his boss (the guy his life is literally dedicated to) is also the (theoretical) voice and will of their actual god.
@Hobo Spoiler I've actually been meaning to pay closer attention to the HW story on an alt for similar reasons. I've seen people get the lore REALLY WRONG because they misread something or were missing info so I take a lot of people on reddit and stuff with a grain of salt...(and tbf I've remembered things wrong too so I try to check the source material whenever possible.) that said my first time through, I thought the "blessing" referred to the transforming power itself and not tempering, but now I wonder if it's both? I'm not sure, though. But there are a couple things that stick out to me. if you read the official short stories "Tales from the Dragonsong War" there is one covering how Zephirin joined the Heavens' Ward. (I'll link them when I get home tonight but I think you can find them on the Lodestone website.) Spoiler: spoilers for that story His predecessor overheard Thordan meeting with the Ascians and was going to confront him about it because he's an honorable old dude, but Thordan had apparently caught wind of this and [sent Zephirin to straight up murder him and then tell everyone he retired and went on a pilgrimage to cover up his disappearance. ] <- actually Charibert did the murdering, idk how my brain edited THAT out of my memory I have a very hard time believing that he'd be tempered at that point in time, even if he is later. Just because he has doubts about Thordan's plan (specifically conspiring w ascians to turn into a primal) doesn't mean he objected for moral reasons or that he's secretly a good person. And keep in mind to become a member of the ward you have to be willing to renounce all outside allegiances for your devotion to the Archbishop, so you have to be the sort of person that thinks that's a good idea--either a religious zealot or totally amoral. (I glances at Charibert....) I'm really bugged by the "Heavens' Ward did nothing wrong because tempered!!" Discourse because the argument always seems to be for the members it's least convincing about. And also that there's some clear cut "good" and "bad" side here instead of a bunch of people doing what they think is right and a whole lot of them fucking up. Also Haurchefant aside (as much as it infuriates me, he was aiming for the WoL which makes tactical sense) Zephirin factually helped Charibert torture Aymeric. Edit: also I'd like to point out that being tempered, even by a chill Primal like Ramuh, seems to drastically alter a person's personality. Edit 2: Spoiler: one MORE thing I've also seen people pointing out the Hildy quests and how the general population of Ishgard knows Thordan is dead but thinks the Heavens' Ward just...disappeared...which is baffling to me. I mean, they're his bodyguards? So if he's dead then clearly we had to go through them to get to him. That said...there's nothing in the game that explicitly points to us (the WoL) landing the killing blow on any of them. You fight about half of them in the Thordan trial but none have death animations. They all show up in a circle for his ultimate attack, and after that they vanish. That leaves 3 options: 1. Thordan actually used up their aether/lifeforce in that attack to try to kill us, so technically HE killed them. 2. In defeating Primal Thordan, because they were connected to him sharing his power, that counted as killing them too. 3. They are actually not dead but somewhere in the Aetherochemical Research Facility. (Unlikely) Edit 3: I remembered that short story very wrong apparently so edited to reflect that
Spoiler: HW in general They struck me as smug, smarmy assholes the first time I fought them - back when I was standing as champion in Tataru's stead. Sure, it was "legal" -- but they were expecting to highkey murder two foreigners for being too nosy into their affairs and get cheered for it.
Spoiler: Responding to spoiler - spoilers up to the end of 3.0 My personal theory is more or less a combination of 1 and 2. The Primal you fight isn't just "Thordan", it's "Thordan and his Knights of the Round", which I suspect was their plan all along -- all thirteen of them, immortal and empowered to demigodhood, together forever to reign over everything (for the good of everyone else, of course, because God-King Thordan Knows Best). Note how during the Vault boss fights their transformations are temporary boosts they only use when they feel the situation calls for it, and they revert and retreat when facing defeat. Thordan doesn't -- not until he doesn't have enough energy left to keep his human form intact. Much like Ysaile's final flight. Compare Ramuh's arbiters, who certainly appear to be discrete entities that nonetheless only exist while Ramuh does -- and contrast the Mogglesguard, who most definitely do exist independently of Good King Moggle Mog, Long May His Reign Be Remembered Fondly (although not, pray Kupo, be repeated) and who can be seen scurrying off in a rout once Good King Moggle Mog goes down for the count.
... And now I'm kind of thinking about the beast tribes and their questlines again. Spoiler: Very minor ARR MSQ, level 40+ or so, some of the repeatable quests Specifically, the Brotherhood of Ash - the Amaa'Ja tribe that explicitly does not follow Ifrit. They're Proud Warrior Race Guys, but done right. They may not be the most comfortable of neighbors, but they consider raiding defenseless warmbloods beneath them, because proper Warriors need a challenge, and a lot of the quests they give you involve things their Tempered former brethren are doing that they consider Conduct Unbecoming A Proud Warrior Race to an offensive degree. For instance, proper PWRG will face their opponent fairly. They do not seed trading routes with the equivalent of IEDs, then wait for the booms and loot the wreckage. Please take this riding drake and use its flame breath to detonate the IEDs. Proper PWRG respect other warrior cultures' customs even when we sometimes fight them. If that Miqo'te tribes' ancestral weapons are important to them, we let their fallen keep them so they can be buried properly. We do not loot their corpses. Please put down those Tempered, recover the tribal weapons they stole that they have no right to, and bring them so we can give them back to the Miqo'te. I could go on and on, but the common theme is that their Tempered kin has lost the way and is acting reprehensibly by their PWRG standards, and despite them being a splinter tribe, they feel it's their responsibility to set things right and make amends. Not because it's their fault, but because setting things right is the right thing to do. I also like that each beast tribe's specific motivation and angle is different from the others. They all want different things (aside from the general thread of "we don't want to serve an omnicidal Primal for all eternity") and they all have different reasons for asking or accepting your help in getting them. I haven't finished all their questlines yet, but I like most of them so far.
So has anyone else used their veteran reward fantasia and then almost immediately been like, "I made a terrible mistake"? Because WHOOPS HAHA I... made a terrible mistake. OTL
Unfortunately, the one I'll need to buy to fix this isn't. :( I wish 7€ wasn't a big deal for me, but it is.
Oh whoops, haha, the way you actually meant it makes more sense. I'm just distraught. I spent hours in the chargen and made three different throwaway alts to testrun faces and I STILL messed up. I can't believe myself sometimes.
Race change. :| I love Au Ra and thought I should fantasia my character into one and... no. Taking a character who I do the same thing with across all his iterations in various games and trying to change him midway through one was a Bad Idea. It might have worked if I could have made his facial structure exactly the same, but since I can't, it just ended up being upsetting. My girlfriend paypal'd me some money so I can buy a new fantasia and change him back. ;_; I'll make an alt so I can have my Au Ra.
i did finally finish the HW story and enjoyed it quite a bit. pumped for stormblood but not sure what to really do until then. i technically have a bunch of dungeon quests i could do but i also just got the new zelda game so i've been like... nah... probably will just clear out my quest log SB launch day and go forth into the new expansion also my new policy has been 'if i a dungeon group is making me anxious, Just Leave' and it's been working out really well for me tbh my biggest hang up is people being shitty so if somebody shows an inkling of it it makes me feel immediately better to just ditch.
That's probably not a bad idea if it's working for you. I'm currently taking a break from wearing my mentor crown because I was feeling a little too much pressure. Anxiety tends to mean I could have 9 good runs but a tenth where someone is rude or mean could ruin my whole day. I've been trying to be braver about speaking up against the mentality that Everything Must Be A Speedrun. I got a sprout tank in Toto-rak the other day who asked me if he should pull more. Who the heck was telling a level 32 Paladin that he should pull more?? Like geez. Let people breathe. Let them learn at their own pace. I love a lot about this game but I feel like I'm often at odds with the Western Community attitude towards content. I miss being on a Japanese server sometimes... (I don't miss the ping tho) ...honestly looking forward to tanks being in high demand when SB hits because it means people can't bully me into speedrunning. If they kick me they have to wait a nice long time for a new tank. I want to try to remember the good stuff too. Like the runs where everyone is chill or we pull through with teamwork when things look dicey. Those happen! I guess it's human nature to focus on the negatives but there are lots of awesome players too. I forgot if I mentioned this but I had a Dun Scaith run where DPS was abysmally low, plus my co-healer was new and died to nearly every mechanic. But we actually didn't wipe once and by the end of it everyone in my party was thanking each other for being chill and not raging. I left with several comms and just...good feelings.
Two of my FC was helping me clear my last three lingering dungeons so I was eligible for the level 50 roulette, and they bitched about the tank we got for Lost City taking small pulls, but I was like he SAID he hadn't done it before, give him a break. It wasn't really particularly slow, and we all did fine. They're usually pretty good about not being like that but that speedrun attitude gets really pervasive, I guess, esp. when you've done the dungeons a million times and usually only grind them for end-game gear. They are at least very patient when helping me learn to tank. (Finally went DRK, going to level it and finish the main story with it for character development reasons.) Sometimes the GOTTA GO FAST attitude bites people in the ass in kind of hilarious ways, like a different tank who was so busy trying to get Copperbell HM over with that she never used Darkside and constantly left me behind, to the point that I ended up locked out of the final boss room and she didn't notice until she ate floor. She kind of made a fool of herself and I think she knew it; I hope that ends up being a bit of a lesson to her. Speaking of DRK, I LOVE FRAY... the lv 40 class quest punched me in the gut.
I think part of my issue with ALL SPEEDRUNS, ALL THE TIME might be a bit of "get off my lawn ya damn kids!!" *shakes cane* Like I've been playing for two years and that mentality that it's expected is a recent development, relatively speaking. I'd say...around 3.3-3.4? Whenever Gubal Library HM was still Expert Roulette. Sure, MSQ Roulette (Castrum and Prae) was always a shitshow bc no one wants to wait for cutscenes, but. it wasn't that people DIDN'T speedrun anything else, but they didn't usually get on your case if you didn't want to and they usually asked first. I'll admit that if you know what you're doing it can be fun! Aki and I figured out some great synergy as a SMN and Bard combo, but the only reason I was running bard in Expert Roulette in the first place was because too many people had been nasty to me for not pulling big as a Paladin. Like more than one healer or dps asking for big pulls, I'd say "no sorry, not comfortable" and then they'd run ahead and grab things and drag them back to me like they were mocking me. Me being a doormat and worrying about my job as tank a lot, I'd do my best to get the stuff off them, but. I didn't (and still don't) entire trust random DF healers, nor did i trust my own ability to hold aggro on more than 3 things at a time without a proper AOE. So enough times of having my preferences disrespected made me give up on tanking for a while. There's also a certain element of knowing your party setup and what certain classes can and can't do. Got a SMN and a BLM? Go to town. Two DRGs? That pull is going to make your healer run out of MP because it'll take too long. This is why big pulls in synced down dungeons are kind of dumb. Without proper aoes, it's just tedious and honestly? If the healer doesn't have to babysit the tank's HP, they can DPS too if they're comfortable with that. On top of that I've noticed a lot of sprouts who have been told to speedrun without really...grasping how to do it effectively, and pushing themselves to and getting the whole party killed. Like it took me til I'd been level 60 for a bit to really understand how to use all my skills effectively, plus I didn't start really understanding the flow of fights and how to look for patterns until then. I didn't really understand what people meant by "the fights are scripted" for a while, even as tank and cataloging each type of mobs moves or aoes or whatever. There's nothing that indicates what boss attack is single target and what's a cleave going to chop the head off of anyone standing next to the tank. You just sort of have to experience and memorize. It feels like newbies are being pushed too hard while they're still learning things.
