tbh the only reasonable dietary advice i have ever come across is literally 'try t have at least 5 portions of vegetables + fruits a day if possible, ideally split to 3 veggie, 2 fruits' and that's not even a weightloss diet that's just 'pls put plant matter in your face, animal protein sources all contain arachidonic acid and you're rheumatic and need to avoid that' in my case, besides just being a generally good guideline. Same with the 'try to restrict meat with dinner to 2 times a week if you can, do one fish meal a week and otherwise try to stick to more or less vegetarian'. dietary restrictions, whether voluntary or involuntary lead to mental stress. Mental stress around food can lead to an unhealthy relationship to food. Unhealthy relationship to food leads to more mental stress and over all decline in mental and physical health. It's to be avoided as much as possible. And before you ask, I'm constantly courting the edge to being underweight bc I'm chronically ill and my sense of hunger is broken about half the time thanks to hyperfocus and the 'tisms. My brain and my body just aren't on speaking terms, to the point where my doctor is glad that I eat cake for breakfast bc at least that's calories and grabbing a small convenience baked good from the cupboard is better than forgetting to eat entirely.
Please do not use random weight loss calculators from around the web oh my god. Those are dangerous, unreliable and probably were never touched by an actual nutritionist/dietician/licensed medical professional. Please do some research and look into getting an actual licensed dietician instead of asking the internet for help. If that is beyond your means or not covered by your insurance, at least make some effort to look into actual scientific research on the topic rather than blindly trusting some cutesy apps you got from the first page of google, because your google results will be literally skewed toward pro-ana content by your previous interaction with the web.
I have a lot of better interests, you're just hearing about the problematic ones. Throwing my hat into the PPC ring was about improving my writing, and I wouldn't have even seen the value of sporking if not for that one story. Heck, the only thing it's good for now is writer's block since I can't get a beta, and I'm about at the point where I'd rather work on either original stuff or rewriting an old fanfiction. I could have left the racism thing at "some SJW lied to me when they said that it was wrong to notice that some people look different and have a different culture based around that," but then when I was learning about autism, I realized that it comes with another civil rights problem. I got back into studying racism and again fell for SJW traps about how doing nothing is still bad. For fatlogic, fatpeoplehate was just shut down, so I went there to try and learn about the enemy. (Basically someone pointed out that the scowling wasn't about a big R floating over my head, it was probably because I was fat.) But fatlogic made some good points about the corruption of BoPo and such for the agenda of some people who don't want to try to be better and try to drag other people down with them. Is bodyacceptance really about not trying to change something when it's possible? Would they really be against someone getting surgery because they don't like the size of their breasts? What about trying to do a couch25k program? I don't have fish, and it's hard to stay interested in fishkeeping discussions even with them because I never got into advanced stuff. I'm not interested in talking to other people about scrapbooking ATM. Lego gets a bit too intense to talk about. Sewing, I don't have the room to do anything. Just reading autism sites gets exhausting. Cooking is in survival mode so I'm mostly interested in EatCheapAndHealthy. About the only thing that might be a good discussion is hoarding.
I recently got recced (by a relatively trustworthy person on health stuff) a meal-planning app that does seem relatively okay for something like that, and isn't focused on weight loss. That being said, they do have a mode for that, using calories-in/calories-out and assuming no change in physical activity from what I can see... And the deficiency is only about 15%. Really far from the difference between 1,200 and 2,000 calories - that's the equivalent of skipping an entire meal.
... You're on a forum where I'm pretty sure some people have been turned away from precisely this sort of surgery for being overweight.
Oh my fucking god stop. That is such complete and utter bullshit it. I. Spoiler: snarky gif Losing weight is fucking hard! Having a healthy diet isn't even always possible! A lot of people end up fat because they can't afford good food that'll actually keep them going! It's either good food that won't give them the energy to stay on their feet all day, or food that's actually really bad for them but won't have them pass out from low blood sugar. Some people are fat because they've got health issues out the ass that make things difficult! And people deserve to see people like them in media! People deserve to be told their body isn't shameful! Spoiler: Self harm, suicidal ideation, tread with caution I deserve to see people like me treated with respect and with character traits beyond "lol eats a lot." I deserve to not want to carve the fat off my own body. I deserve to not want to die and start over because losing weight is an uphill battle. I deserve to not be more ashamed of my stretch marks than my self-harm scars. It's not about "not trying to change" it's about learning to accept how you are right now, even if you want to be different or are working toward being different, without filling every ounce of fat on your body with self-loathing because society keeps telling you that all you are is your fat, you fucking fatass, and the only way to redeem yourself is starvation or surgery. So fucking miss me with "people are co-opting body positivity because they don't want to do any wooork" and fuck you for perpetuating the "lazy" part of "lazy fatass." You know why most people stop trying to get better? Because they feel hopeless. Because the entire fucking world is telling them they're a useless, lazy, whiny super fat fatty who could be a real person (that is, skinny) if they just put some effort into it. You know why I've only lost 50 pounds in eight years? Because my body has been falling apart since I was born and my brain isn't in better shape. Because I'm two steps away from crippled and even light exercise (hell, even things that wouldn't even be classed as exercise- say, a brisk walk from one end of the house to the other) makes me feel like I'm dying because all my important parts are broken. I'm lucky I was at the weight I was when I started- I could be a lot heavier except having family around kept me from descending too far. And it's not because I'm ~perfect the way I am~ or I don't want to try. It's because shit is hard and it hurts and dealing with any of it can result in depressive swings because it all feels so damn hopeless. And I still want body positivity and representation for people with my shape. I want to feel alright with this body! I want to not be ashamed of it, even though I want it to change! I want to accept that this is the body I have, right now, and work to make it better! I'm not even fucking touching the breast surgery comment, because you managed to miss the point entirely just talking about weight. If that can of worms gets opened someone's going to have to eat the whole damn thing.
Also buying their whole thing about people just not ~trying hard enough~ seems like the same lack of logic you applied to "I read a website that said Jews totes run the media. It wasn't covered in swastikas so I think it's legit" and "people are glaring at me, specifically, clearly it's because they're black and are assuming I'm a racist." You're completely willing to buy (or come up with) blanket statements without any examination. Maybe work on your critical thinking skills. And not having the empathic capacity of a peanut.
Well yes. Starving yourself will indeed cause you to lose weight... and then die. Which, admittedly, decomposition is an effective method of keeping it off! I believe 1400 kcal is considered torture under the Geneva convention... Bodies aren't actually a bunsen burner. The proportion of different nutrients that are burned vs stored varies from person to person, and situation to situation. As far as evolution is concerned, you're still one meal removed from famine. Your metabolism wants to store fat, and will adjust how much of your caloric intake is stored until the amount of fat it deems appropriate is acquired. The problem, of course, is that while this works well enough in a feast-or-famine state of nature, it doesn't work so well when you try to trickle out an 'insufficient' amount of calories. The body goes into starvation mode, reducing the level of energy available, while waiting for food to become available - but all the while, it expects things to get worse at any moment, so does not eat into its fat stores unless absolutely necessary (in part because fat is biologically useful for purposes other than just energy storage - insulation, transfer of chemicals, etc). Thus, dieting results in reduced energy, irritability, increased appetite, and... general unpleasantness, with relatively little weight loss. And then of course, when you stop... 'FOOD NOW?! TIME FOR ALL THE FOOD!'
I agree that losing weight is hard. The lack of good food is an issue that something should be done about. People who have health issues that contribute to weight gain aren't the target. I also agree that beauty standards in the media need to take a hike. I can't think of any examples of a woman character that just happens to be fat. Society does need to give leeway about weight. There's a huge gap between skinny and being heavy enough to stress the frame. Can we agree that maybe the spokespeople who could do something about being huge are actually the ones causing a lot of damage? And the hopelessness is part of the problem. It's the difference between actually determining that nothing can be done, or just accepting it without seeing if something can be done. Body Positivity's message of worthiness even before the changeable things change needs to be louder because people are hearing "give up." I'm making an effort, it just seems to be not enough or really going in the wrong direction. I really did try to examine why I was being scowled at, and it just didn't occur to me that despite a coincidence each one of them might have had a different reason. As far as empathy, how do I increase it? I see so much to care about that I just keep burning out.
Anecdata: I’m 5’2. The NIH calculator says my BMI is normal. I walk for half an hour on the treadmill three times a week, usually with an average grade of between 3 and 5 and an average speed of 2.8 mph or higher. Other than that I’m fairly sedentary. I don’t count calories, but I’m pretty certain I only fall at or below 1200 when I’m having a particularly bad self care day or my sleep cycle is so whacked out that I spend most of the day in bed. Thanks in a large part to my family, I eat pretty well in terms of variety and nutrition. I’m working on incorporating more green vegetables into meals besides dinner, but I’m doing pretty well these days. I still take a daily regimen of vitamin supplements (as per medical instructions) to safeguard against deficiencies. Some of that is due to meds making it impossible to get enough of certain things, mostly B6, from a healthy diet. The rest is an extra buffer against days when my intake would fall in the 1200-or-lower range. Even if I could get by without the calories (I can’t, that’s a health concern I’m continuing to address) I would begin to suffer from some pretty nasty deficiencies simply because there isn’t enough food in a diet like that to contain everything I need. ETA: Just had breakfast. Two eggs, cereal with half a banana, a medium handful of blueberries, whole milk, and a spoonful of plain yogurt mixed in for extra flavor. That seems to be about 550 calories and I haven’t had my coffee yet.
Where's that Tumblr post about how having ancestors who were starved at critical periods makes it harder to lose weight for people now, and does anyone know of any specific scientific studies on the issue? Dieting too hard now is gonna make both you and your kids fatter in the long run.
Okay. Bluntly? Yes. Body acceptance means not trying to change something, even if it's possible. And I have a real beef with your categorising people who don't want to be "better" -- and, saints and little fucking fishes, better by whose metric? The BMI? Some random GP who has no specialisation in dietetics? A bariatric surgeon? Some rando on the street, or the internet, who just doesn't like a particular body type? Better fucking how? -- as dragging other people down. I'm sorry, you don't get to decide that. You don't get to say that someone fat being happy in their own skin somehow corrupts the movement for body positivity. For fuck's sake. Add to that fact that it takes considerable effort, physically and mentally, to lose weight -- even more effort to keep that weight from regaining, considering the body's homeostatic mechanisms referenced upthread -- then I do not, absolutely do not, blame anyone for saying "fuck it, I'm not going to participate in this horseshit anymore." I think it would be a healthier world if everyone did do that. And please, before you even mention health or try to argue that Health At Every Size means fat people should at least be trying, can you consider the horrible ableism in that? Because health will mean different things to different people (for me, its being able to walk upstairs more than twice a day) -- sacrificing mental health for a slight and not-even-guaranteed increase in physical health actually goes against holistic principles. {Aside: Human bodies are particularly complex, and can't be treated as a machine. There's the interplay of so many factors to consider -- genetic, in utero, environmental, social, physical, chemical -- that we can't just go '''blah blah violating laws of thermodynamics' because a living, breathing, body is not a closed system. } Teal deer: there are lots of things which it's possible to change about the human body, but that doesn't mean anyone is obligated to, and no-one should be made to feel that they are obligated to, especially not from someone who doesn't know, and is not entitled to know, the details of their life.
Oh my god shut the fuck up stop trying to stan for the fucked up communities you belong to! Whether or not people want to lose weight is their fucking choice and they have a right to be treated well irrespective of their choice. There’s no “obligation to change when possible” and if someone chooses not to pursue weight loss you have no fucking say in the matter.
If they're obligated to lose weight why aren't you obligated to learn how to treat people like they're people?
People aren't obligated to lose weight, especially since doing so is really hard and not instant. The ones that don't have excuses just need to stop pretending that they do. I'm trying to learn how to be a human being, and it just doesn't seem to be working. If there was a time to give up, I think that this might be it. I want to just going to stop trying to be human and hope that giving up will grant me a troll's stone skin. Or maybe I'll swim out into the ocean and join that ecosystem. I don't know what post triggered it, but my drunk thoughts wandered into the possibility that I died a few years ago and this is my purgatory. (It seems kinda nice for hell.) Every time I run into a social rule and flip it on how I've been treated, it just doesn't make sense; like it's a funhouse mirror.
instead of the tumblr post, would you like the actual thing? It's to do with DNA-methylation and basically allows to fasttrack evolution by changing expression patterns in genes instead of hoping for a genetic change itself. The field in its entirety is known as 'epigentics'. There are also prenatal methylation effects to similar ends (here). Metabolism therefore one of those things that relatively easily and relatively persistently fall 'prey' to epigenetic influences (here for a number of suggested venues). Here for more effects on human (male inheritance line only) (also: putting only 1200 calories into your body is a GREAT way for your body to start going 'WE ARE LITERALLY STARVING HOLD ONTO ALL THE NUTRIENTS YOU CAN' which can and DOES make weight loss harder because several hundred thousand, if not million years of human evolution have had starvation be a major risk so attempting to cling to the calories you get used to be a VERY sensible response by the body! In times of easy accessible calorie-dense food, it's not longer necessary for many of us but our bodies havn't got that memo yet. This is one of the main causes of the so-called YoYo effect, as post 'oh god we nearly starved' reaction of your body means you will not just shovel calories into you face like nobody's business, you body will do its damn best to keep them, too) Fake edit: pinging @Greallan because I feel like you ought to see this
Random fact I'm putting out there: When my ex was in the army, he had a hell of a time because of his weight. They track BMI, and they track overall weight, and they gauge measurements alongside age and of all things: neck size. Like. Circumference. His problem was that his body was built like a weight lifter, not a body builder. He had a fuck ton of muscle, was strong as shit and healthy as a horse, but he carried weight around his midsection to be able to handle that strain on his body. It was a sheathe that made his waist match his barrel chest. The down side? Whenever he dropped weight, he dropped it in his face, his neck, and his ass. Nowhere else. So he had all this extra weight from muscle and it was still making him look TERRIBLE on the charts that they were required to use, charts that literally all the doctors and officers HATED because they were such old science and disproven already as being inaccurate but were still the requirements, and he kept almost losing his job. He was having to exercise more than the insane amount he already was per day and change all of his eating habits, and it was still a struggle because the BMI and the neck measurement thing kept hiccupping any time he so much as breathed wrong. He got so stressed out from that that he started gaining not-normal-for-him fat which made it even WORSE, because his cortisol was going haywire and they couldn't medically control it aside from urging him to meditate, calm down, rest more and try to relax and de-stress himself. tldr: US Military doctors and medics hate the BMI charts they're required to use because they don't take individual bodies into account nor actual human weight distribution if you don't fit their perfect cardboard cut out example and it makes people start toward disordered eating and some really unhealthy habits trying to forcefully stay in those ranges to keep their fucking jobs. It's not like "oh you need to stay slim and trim!", it was legit ridiculous. Someone gifted with a naturally thick neck would be able to have more weight on them and look almost obese but be in the weight and height limits just fine.
Yeah, going to starvation levels means you'll lose weight short-term but gain fat, because your body will direct all the calories into storage instead of into actually letting your bodily processes work.
This thread is making me wonder if I eat too much junk food, which I definitely do, because I'm not getting enough nourishment at mealtimes. I should probably keep a counter for a bit?
can you please talk about that in a different thread? this one is for explaining to greallan what is wrong with r/fatlogic, not general discussion of food, weight and eating.
