You use a lot of language like "needs to be said" and "forcing me to defend myself". Take more ownership of your choices. You are deciding both whether to "defend yourself" and how to do it. So far, your choices have not been working out well for you.
Hey Athol so just to clarify Re Allyssa's post, quoted in full right here, you would count as an attack? Or am I misreading you? edit: If the post IS what you'd consider an attack, what about it is it that makes it one?
We keep sitting here and providing examples where fatlogic rhetoric is wrong, but you keep bringing it up like you think that it's fact. I stated that it was fatlogic rhetoric, so it should have been clear that it belonged to that group. I gave no indication of where I was in it and she made a pretty wild assumption based on how it compared to the truth. I think that's what people are frustrated with? We tell you how your/the community you're in logic is wrong, but then you counter with more of the logic that we just argued against. More expanding on that assumption. Sometimes the point needs to be attacked directly because the argument doesn't cover it. Refer to the CICO debate in general... The whole thing is nuanced, and I think the message they quoted from had me admit that it wasn't the end-all. I think it would help if you included more markers on whether or not you believe the thing you're saying. Like, this particular post was okay: pointing out that it's fatlogic rhetoric indicates that you might not necessarily believe all of it. But most of this thread, you've just been stating things as fact So by the time they got to that, they lost me, especially with the "hey improvement" coming after a whole lot of tearing me down. I'm very used to not being listened to, so if they start with tearing me down, I'm likely to get stuck on them believing that forever.
Can you please elaborate on how that first line is tearing you down? 'Cause it's very gently phrased and explains the problem that I'd elaborated on for you in the dm here:
I thought a bit about it... I guess it's because one disagreement got me labelled bigot, one line in my vent got me labelled serophobe before I even knew that was a thing... It's just too much "I don't like what you believe in, so you're a bad person who deserves nasty names to reinforce how bad you are." I'm surprised I haven't gotten a new label that you could rub in my face for hanging out with the fat-haters.
But like... What about when what you believe in is racist? Like, let's set aside it being your beliefs for a moment. When someone, anyone, believes a racist thing, that's them being racist. Racist intent or not, it's still racism. What you're saying here makes no sense, because words mean things.
So. It might be worth to point out. These are not labels to give you nasty names. These are labels based on actions. If I say something racist, even if I don't don't know it's racist, and say it with sincerity because I believe it's true, that thing is still racist, those beliefs are racist, and that make me a racist. It is not an attack for someone to say , "Hey, that's fucking rasict, asshole!" even if I don't like the tone it's delivered in. The correct course of action is to go, "Oh shit sorry I didn't know that! I was always told/always heard this, is that not true?" and then you make an effort to unlearn the thing. Because it IS an effort.
I have seen the posts, cause there are more than one, in question in your vent. Spoiler: elaboration, cw for things you'd expect from context Wishing an LGBT person would die of aids is....pretty unambiguously serophobic, and given context of your post, homophobic. Wishing death on anyone is a pretty fucked up thing to do anyway but that specific method of death is...it's alarmingly cruel, to wish that on someone.
Emphasis mine. I don't see what that has to do with anything. Knowing that it's a thing is completely irrelevant. Wishing death on people is creepy at best, and this wasn't anywhere near best.
Those are incredibly bad faith questions and I refuse to personally engage with them without rewording if your intent is not bad faith.
play bitch games, win bitch prizes you spout off racist shit, you're going to be called racist. "but I didn't KNOW it was racist/homophobic/serophobic/etc" stops being an acceptable excuse sometime during the teenage years, bc that's when humans learn how to not be giant gaping assholes to each other what liking jewish things was never the issue the issue was you saying that jews control the media, which is an old anti-semitic conspiracy theory [edit to remove reaction image] there's a lot to unpack here but let's just give the suitcase to the bomb squad
My intent isn't bad faith and I don't know what people want from me. Ask questions and I'm going to try to go to sleep and answer them in the morning.
more practically speaking theres a lexical difference between phobias as a fear-based mental illness and phobias as a targeted bigotry towards a specific group but 0% chance u didn't know that already
And yes, reading these responses is going to hurt, but at this point i can't even ask people to not be terse because you just...don't listen. I give you tips on how to communicate more effectively without making everyone assume the worst and you just don't seem to even try to use them. There's literally no way I can read those questions you asked in good faith even if I try really hard to continue believing you're asking them in good faith. It's like the edgy version of sealioning, you keep Just Asking Questions in the most offensive ways possible and then getting mad when people are hurt by your words. You need to stop it and do some serious introspection and also get clean and go to therapy.
Athol, I think that's the same pattern: you're going several steps in one hop, and confusing people. Exposure therapy for spiders doesn't mean throwing you in a spider pit and making you The Spider Queen - it just involves being around them a bit until you can not freak out. Being comfortable with other people's sexual lifestyles doesn't mean 'slutting around' - it just involves being around them a bit until you can not freak out. Make friends with people who do things that bother you, and just... accept them. You don't have to do the things yourself, you just need to let them not be a big deal. It seems like you've assumed way too far ahead, and then challenged people on a conclusion they didn't reach. (And in fact, would not have reached, because they were headed somewhere else) This is a big part of what seems to keep going wrong in your interactions. I would recommend that you slow way down in your reasoning, take little tiny single steps, and wait for people to catch up. That way, if it turns out they're headed in a different direction, it's much, much easier to stay with them. (Also, it's likely that people could take offence to 'slutting around', as it could come across as an accusation/judgement, even though you were only applying it to yourself in that context) Edit: autocorrect got your name wrong.
Alternate wording maybe?? "I feel like you're all saying I'm bigoted for liking Jewish things. Is that correct?" No. Like, why did you say this? Did you expect a serious answer of "yes" or Just make friends with LGBT folks The way to do that is not insult us, engage with us on non-inflammatory topics, and show understanding and appreciation when we go out of our way to educate you despite the fact you keep saying super offensive things. Consider us human.
Oh nice, tease me for saying that I don't know what people want. This is why I HATE BEING SO FUCKING STUPID.
