Reporting the mods

I actually like this "no more feedback on wiggled posts" idea. It protects users, protects the mods, and means that she gets literally no attention (to follow Paradigm Shift's theory) or chance to win and prove herself right (which is what I think she's after) except to the extent that she figures out how to say non-horrible things.

Also I have the unkind urge to make her do her own homework.

 

Nothing unkind to making her do her own homework. I don't think it'll really stick unless she has to figure it out herself.

 

It's true. Its not unkind. It means she'll either have to do the work if she wants people to give her anymore attention on that matter.

 

Oh for fucks sake.

I am in favour of banning at this point I think. Athol has previously laid out that she wants to do "an experiment on grudges" to me with Spock, and from context cues and her latest behavior that speaks of a desire to keep trying to hurt Spock because she wants to make her look unreasonable and hysterical. And I'm not fucking here for it. I'm not here for Athol continually, deliberately, trying to drive someone to emotional extremes to try to echo her own behaviour and Validate her worldview. If she did this to any other member of the forum it would be fucking dangerous to other people as well as deeply unhealthy for herself.
I've been worried for years about what would happen if an unrepentant abuser showed up and kept trying to hurt people. I'm just glad she's fucking bad at it.

 

Competing needs get brought up as an argument often when talk of bans and peoples' differences surface, and I want to head that off. Is there literally anyone on the forum that would benefit from Athol's compulsion and drive to be here, including and especially Athol at this point?

 

that is why i specified that while i'd prefer not banning... i can't actually go through the TCHGB thread with spock anymore, i suppose, is the most succinct way to put it. i can barely handle the vitriol and abuse she displays that gets through, and only because i have her on ignore and can choose how and when i engage with her content. i could not handle her as a mod. so i'm not gonna ask that they do.

i'd be sad if she gets banned, because the premise of "no one gets banned" is one i find appealing, but i'm not gonna weight that more heavily against the wellbeing of the mod team (who thankfully appear to be handling this well and without much damage)

 

Yeah I'm not saying it should be an immediate thing and I'm open to changing my stance but there's just...like

The only time she's walked back on anything she has said in public in these threads and there's any attempt at doing better has been when it upsets me? She was going to let the issue with Jove lie, for instance. And man I, really don't like the implications of that. I really don't like the fact that she's tried to manipulate me into the role of The Only Person Who Can Get Her To Say Sorry while also trying to emphasize that she believes I'm disposable. While I'm glad she experiences regret when she hurts me, it's.

I've been in this position before and it doesn't end well should shit flip around. I don't want anyone who can't deal with playing the game to be nudged into that position instead, but I also don't want to call for Nobody To Talk To Her or anything like that, but there is a legit and real concern that she will keep trying to pull any random person she thinks supports her case into this stuff whenever something goes south, and.

Yeah it's a mess, and I do not believe for an instant that she doesn't grasp even half the stuff she's been told. She has these same patterns of manipulation going back to the PPC, who also told her it wasn't acceptable. My last long post lays out my views on it best I think.

I'm just gonna state that I refuse to be the golden child again, and from now on if I need to do deconstruction of Athol's posts I'm not going to be constantly affirming her humanity and right to do self care when she reliably does the thing of saying nobody thinks she is human. Not to prove her right, but because I'm not gonna be a source of narc chow that allows her to keep walking around in circles without ever actually learning anything.

She still needs to apologize to Spock for two distinct instances of severely threatening behavior, to Spock & Snitch and Rigel for sexual harassment in the wiggler and to Snitch and Spock for sexual harassment outside of it, to the rest of the mod team for hurling verbal abuse at them, to Jove, to me, to Lizardlicks for the fuckin' slenderman comment.

 

Like I know we laughed at that one but it was still wishing a person would be captured and eaten alive in a moment of rage and I don't think that should be neglected in the apology roundup.

 

I figured out the "I'm not human" part though. See, if she's human, that means reasonably she would eventually have to learn, grow, and change in response to being told something she is doing is wrong. Instead, when she's told that what she is doing is wrong and hurtful and she needs to stop, what she does is say, "aha, but if I am a monster, I can keep doing wrong things, because monsters aren't human, and they never need to learn, grow or change." So when we say "hey, that's bad, stop it," she thinks "aha, that must mean I am bad, and that must mean that I'm not human, so I won't stop!"

It a strange but effective sort of logic.

 

I see what you're saying Lizardlicks (I am not sure if you want to be pinged so not quoting / pinging) but I honestly can't see Athol having that kind of logical loop. I say this because the 'I'm not human' comments are VERY targeted and directed during specific moments and don't feel as if she's actually thinking she's not human. I guess what I'm saying is: she's clearly only here to bait out attention / narc chow. The likelihood of her actually considering herself bad / wrong in any way shape or form is incredibly low. At least that's my reading of her. With this said, this is the internal logic I'd guess she has:

"If I say 'I'm not human' people will pat me on the head and feel bad for me." "If I act like the victim / say I'm not human people will pity me and give me attention." "If I act the victim / say I'm not human it makes the people I'm arguing with look like bullies."

All that said, I think she's a troll. She's doing this for attention and for validation, and that can be gotten by a narcissist by getting negative attention. She's being validated by proving how terrible the mods are for silencing her and how inconsiderate and oversensitive we are by reacting how we do. She's done this multiple times, she's admitted to running on reddits like FatLogic (which are RIFE with trolls and people who do this kind of negative validation crap). Her behavior as a whole does not read as good faith, she intentionally loops shit around to make more and more drama for her to either narc chow on or laugh at. Is she hurting herself? Maybe. If there's a little truth in what she says, she could be. It could be argued that she's hurting herself by focusing on only getting negative attention to feed her need for attention.

The question is though, if she's actually a troll and not hurting herself by being here (aka enjoying her fucking with us) what do you do? She's purely hurting others in that logic, yet we don't ban people here. Like... I guess it really doesn't matter either way. She is actually hurting people here, there were multiple times with how she attempted to manipulate Kathy that I was wondering why the charade kept going. I get wanting to help everyone but we all know, via experience I'm sure, that you can't help someone unless they help themselves. If she's a lost narc or a dedicated troll it doesn't matter, when does the good of the one outweigh the good of the many?

Like, this has been by and far the worst series of interactions on this forum and I can't even see the wiggler. I cannot imagine how hard this is on the mods, like just purely from a 'this is exhausting' point of view. There have been multiple fallouts on this forum but I would argue that none of them were as damaging / dangerous as Athol is / could be.

I guess I'm a jerk for not really caring about how she feels about this, but I think at this point it's best for everyone to cut off her access to the forum. I've never played with the forum software under xenforo so I don't know if IP ban is a possibility to try and slow possible stealth accounts being made (as IP ban is avoidable it is not a hard and fast fix).

As a side note, I'm also of the opinion that nothing she has said about herself can be trusted. Even if she's trying to tell the truth, her perception of reality is so skewed that everything she says needs to be taken with an entire salt mine's worth of salt.

 

I do believe she feels subhuman. She's made that very clear in ways that I take as legit. You don't develop a drinking problem that excessive combined with those attention seeking behaviors and anger issues if you feel Good about yourself in my experience. I do firmly believe she's using that feeling to excuse her actions though and unless she decides to get professional help there's not really much to be done. I stand by my big post on the matter. I feel compassion for her pain but I'm not gonna put myself in a shitty position to reassure her. I believe it's best practice to believe someone when they tell you that they're hurting. My mother is certainly being legitimate when she tells me she feels Pain for me not contacting her as much, even if that Pain comes from the fact she cannot control me anymore. It just means I shouldn't indulge her because the pain comes from an unhealthy place.

 

Honestly, she reminds me exactly of my aunt; when the wounded duck act doesn't get the response she's looking for, she goes on the attack with whatever nastiness she can think of. It's not about logic, it's about just getting something- anything- to stick. Anything that makes her feel like she's scored a point. Scoring points is winning and makes her feel good, even if she's digging herself an inescapable hole in the process. She doesn't read as a troll to me, just someone who's so far down the rabbit hole she's drinking tea with the marsh hare and hatter

 

That seems like an insult to the good Hatter and his friend the Hare.

 

agreed. she's a pretty classic compensatory narcissist afaict. this is all speculation on my part, but I think the feeling subhuman isn't an act, it's the reason athol behaves the way she does. she's desperately trying to feel good about herself bc she genuinely feels like shit most of the time. but her ways of trying to feel good about herself a) are horribly abusive and b) don't work. but she can't admit that her methods don't work bc that would mean she's wrong, and that would make her feel like she's even worse than she already sees herself. in the same vein, she can't give a genuine apology bc that's admitting she's wrong and her brain is protecting her from ever doing that.

if anyone wants to see a good portrayal and inside view of compensatory narcissism, I'd suggest watching bojack horseman. the title character is... well, also a compensatory narcissist. which might be a put-off to a lot of people and that's valid, but if you aren't put off by watching deeply flawed people screw up their lives, highly rec. (also the show is fucking hilarious and even tho it takes a long time the characters actually do get better, little by little)

 

So I'm late to Wankmas huh

 

this thread has been peacefully dormant for five whole days lets see if it can be a whole week

 

The food's kinda stale and has funny colors and I'm pretty sure the mac'n'cheese is moving the way mac'n'cheese shouldn't move, but I just can't look away