Discussion in 'General Advice' started by BlackholeKG, Aug 26, 2016.
Yeah it does
The truth as I see it is that you are way way way deep in a self loathing spiral. And if you disagree with me that´s fine.
Also if it helps, I have a very good relationship with my parents. Both my parents are mentally ill and have not always made the best decisions, but I trust that they care about me. That is the basis I have for how I see your parents behaviour. Again make of that what you will.
Just because Josie did not use the word kneejerk does not magically mean she did not use a word or phrase meaning the same damn thing. You´re nitpicking. And this is NOT the place.
ETA: never even mind.
Rigs, it really feels like the advice you were giving Josie would work really well for a high schooler with a pretty good relationship with their parents.
But I don't think this situation works for it.
Josie, do you accept that you have had past issues with scrupulosity - like, for instance, when you worry that you are a bad person because you say or do things that you would not personally characterize as bad in other people?
and is it possible, right now, to consider that this issue is not primarily your fault, and also to possibly reread this thread imagining that instead of you in this situation, it is a good friend of yours?
I think those are two related but also quite different questions. They are different categories of questions. The first is a question of fact and the second is a question of policy. And also, as stated, they are so vague that I don't think they are answerable--at least in any meaningful or useful way.
Can I ask you some questions to try to get some context and clarify what's going on?
Damn! Search function is seriously FUCKED UP!
I'm gonna assign some fault and it's all seebs's
I'm going to sleep now so I will not be able to answer questions right away.
this, seriously. you have a bunch of legitimately harsh shit to deal with and it is affecting your whole life, as that tends to do. your folks are frustrated about their kid being Not Optimally Functional but they pretty clearly don't know what, if anything, would actually help you, so instead they're resorting to bootstraps and letting their frustration steer the entirety of the conversation. it's a mess. I've been That Kid, and to a much, much greater extent, my sibling was That Kid - mental illness meets lack of appropriate resources and becomes exponentially compounding dysfunctions. it's not a situation in which you OR your parents CAN take full responsibility, but each of you can make respective parts of it worse or better. and worse is frankly the easiest option & allows for cathartic(unhelpful) yelling
I dunno if I should go into my sibling's situation because it was a very different mental illness situation, also this could become tl;dr, but rigs is very right to suggest that all three of you need to find better tools. maybe if you float it as 'mediation'/'a facilitator with suggestions' they might agree to give counselling a shot.
Josie, you need to be in therapy. Individual therapy, and possibly a pharmaceutical or two. You cannot accurately judge your actual contributions to the situation (or lack thereof) right now because your brain is constantly putting a thumb on the scales by answering every single question with "you are bad! you are evil! everything is your fault! you're lazy!". If, after you have given therapy a serious try, that solves the parent issues, great. If it doesn't, well then, we can escalate.
I think that this is significantly more important than family therapy, especially given that you will be at university.
I have my own thoughts on your parents. If this were in a locked forum or Skype I would be happier to discuss the issue. In a public forum I would rather keep them to myself. Brainbugs, y'know.
I can't fix this and a family counselor isn't going to happen
I hate being responsible for part of this and that seems to be the consensus. I hate that a part of me really wants to hear otherwise.
I don't know how I can fix this. I just... I don't want to do the things. But I guess I have to?
Lbr all this internet shit is Not Real anyway and no amount of advice or perspective given here is worth anything compared to the real world situation in which I either need to improve myself or else let this continue.
Edit: I wrote this before VE posted so this isn't in response to that
Feel free to Skype me any thoughts if you want, but I might not reply straight away as I am meant to be sleeping, or trying to.
You're not responsible for your brainfuckery. Your brainfuckery happened. It could happen to anyone, really. You did not ruin your relationship with your parents by having OCD or depression or scrupulosity. They happened to you, and the best you can do is learn to steer around them. It's a pity your parents don't have a schema of the world in which this would be possible.
the very root of it is that you are struggling. it causes everything else to be harder. a very reductive view of this would describe it as ""your fault"" but that fails to get at the root of anything. part of the thing you're struggling with is your brain insisting that the entirety of it is your fault, thus making it an insurmountable problem. hence any sort of counseling or treatment being a very wise idea. when things are hard it's a good idea to get help; this is just a different kind of hard and a different kind of help.
I very much feel the difficulty of convincing your folks to go to a counsellor with you, it is a fucking trial and may take some time to figure out. but given the choice between 'I have to do this thing I think is unnecessary' and 'nothing gets better' or 'my kid suffers more', a lot of folks will decide that the former is a reasonable investment. I dunno how you would convey this to them, but the feeling of 'wishing you'd tried even small frivolous things after you'd dismissed them out of hand and then everything got worse' is a horrible feeling and I am sure they'd prefer not to experience it.
This whole thing is fucked, I don't want to go through stress trying to sort things with my parents I just want to move out.
I wish I had real money. I wish I didn't rely on them for everything. Even at uni I'm still going to have to rely on them, unless they really do not send me those money installments (but they probably will and I can't not accept them).
witnessed. I'm sorry it's all landed on you like this. hope ur night goes better or does not get worse.
Perfectly valid course of action. You can still sort thing out with them after you´ve moved out. It might actually work better when you´re not in each others pocket all the time.
The concept of "correct" is really holding you back, in my opinion. There is no objectively correct thing to do; life is much too complicated for that. In my experience, it's been more useful to concentrate on the question of what is compassionate, what is diplomatic, what is helpful - sort of more of a virtue ethics approach rather than an attempt to concretely quantify objective moral guilt.
Where are you going to uni? I may be able to point you towards some more specific resources.
the "are you even listening?" thing dismisses the other participant's participation as insufficient bc it isn't wholehearted and instant agreement. when people say that, what they mean is "you obvs aren't listening bc you haven't agreed completely and told me how wonderful everything I've said has been."
at least, that's been my experience
yeah, that's not ok. like, really really not ok. the thing your dad is doing is stating his belief that you don't and shouldn't have any power in your relationship and life, and whenever you argue w him on it he's gonna take that as a sign of immaturity, which will just further reinforce this belief. it's a shitty and manipulative thing to do, and it's a fairly common thing w abusive parents
rigs is kind of right when he says that trying to find out who's at fault is rarely helpful, but in this case I have to say that you're putting too much of the blame on yourself. everything about this situation sounds like your parents are reacting badly to your impending departure to uni. I'm not sure if they're having trouble dealing w change or if they're upset that they're losing control over you, but either way this seems like a "parents taking things out on the kid" type of thing, disguised as "wanting you to be better," which is a v effective way to prey on your anxiety, esp since you have an anxiety thing about being good/correct
Josie, I think the best thing for you is going to be therapy and a proper diagnosis, bc it sounds like depression might have hitched itself on to your anxiety disorder (which wouldn't be surprising since they have a high comorbidity rate)
If nothing else, your parents are trying to deal with their emotions in a way that is harmful and ineffective, but supported by our culture. British society is not good at being open/expressive/emotionally progressive, even within the family home. This is another reason why trying to attribute guilt blame is not going to be productive - there are some deeply ingrained cultural factors informing your parents' perspectives, and that just makes it even more important that they realise that they have to work on your relationship too (rather than just placing a bunch of nebulous demands on you).
I've been so anxious about this all this morning at work, I don't know how to solve this :c
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