Not sure where else to put this.

considering im one of those obnoxious 'no doubles!!!1!!!!!' fuckers the only thing standing between us and a world full of kin drama is the lack of other latulakins and my self control to not be an annoying bastard in public

 

Seebs is.....forum deletion and A Clean Slate? That seems inaccurate.

 

I mean, I can relate on the front of 'self control to not be an annoying bastard in public." Sort of. I mean, look at the early pages of this thread for me being more of an annoying bastard than I am now.

 

at the very least my particular form of annoying kin bastardism is a panic spiral because i dont do the roleplay typing instead of 'kys fake'

 

god every time alix pulls some new shit i just wanna

 

Like. I have never wanted to see someone Stop Doing Thing so badly but it just keeps happening.

 

OH OH WAIT ANOTHER THING PEOPLE ARE GONNA GET MAD AT ME FOR

Pornhub isn't a progressive website and doesn't deserve asspats.

 

Meh, I don't wanna yell. Might poke you about some of it later when you have the spoons, though, I am legit curious what you think about stuff!

 

What if I agree, but I thrive on conflict and I want to argue for the sake of arguing? :-)

 

Feel free to poke; if I ever don't respond because low spoons and forget, feel free to poke again and remind me,

I'd say you're probably better off arguing with someone who actually disagrees. I like arguing, but I still have limited spoons.

 

let's see if you're really problematic
what's your opinion on Sailor Moon?

 

fun tip when on mobile if you turn your phone sideways you can see more stuff (like signatures and viewcounts)

 

Literally everything hinges on their answer to this. Everything.

 

Sadly, I have not watched or read Sailor Moon. But it looks enjoyable and the art is cute.

This works on some of my devices but not others, funnily enough.

 

hey! soooooo I'm pretty sure you have no idea I exist, and to be honest I don't remember any of your specific posts outside of this thread? so I'm pretty sure you don't Have An Issue with me, and I definitely don't with you, and I saw you'd raised some interesting points recently. I think they'd be interesting to discuss if you're up for it, "discussion" being mainly "eP asks nitpicky definition questions to figure out if he agrees or not." no worries if you don't want to engage, but I saw you invited discussion earlier, so I figured I'd ask.

ALSO I am really not sure if my views on these subjects are those of a Typical Kintsugijin^TM, and I'm curious to know if they are! I won't take it personally or anything, I just don't know how I fit into the Broader Culture, so if you don't mind, I'd like your opinion on that, too. (also, ftr, I don't come from Tumblr—I got here through Seebs' Tumblr, obviously, but I only read a couple other blogs, and I never had one of my own. my exposure is pretty secondhand. I think that's unusual on Kintsugi? and might inform my views?)

'course not, but would you mind explaining what it doesn't justify? also, when is it relevant to whether something's dandy? (I'm not clear on what Seebsian Issue you're referring to here, sorry.)

yeah, I actually think it's a good thing, since it usually builds (self-)awareness and calls assumptions into question. it's not an unqualified good, though, depending on the situation. what constitutes "criticism"?

yeah, uh... "it happens to everyone, so shut up and stop complaining about it!!!" is a pretty bad justification, lol. are you talking about fetishization in fandom spaces specifically? if so, what must someone/something do in order to fetishize?

it's definitely fine, but I'm one of those squishy "love everybody (ノ◕ヮ◕)ノ*:゜✧" moralists, so I wouldn't say it's great, and I myself wouldn't want to. regardless, what constitutes wariness?

yeah, of course, I'd say any given category of person are capable of being good people. I would say that NPD inclines people to be inconsiderate of others, and that good people are considerate, which is why it's a personality disorder. that being said, it's an inclination, not a life sentence, and it's certainly not inevitable. so yes, of course they're capable, they just... have to combat that inclination. (this is based on my knowledge of NPD, which is certainly not comprehensive, so if that inconsiderate inclination thing isn't true, lemme know.) re: the emoji, is it shitty because the colloquial "narcissist" term evokes an actual NPD diagnosis, and people shouldn't be flinging around diagnoses as insults like that, or?

are you talking about people using CP/CSA/rape/abuse/etc. fiction as a coping method here? 'cause generally, coping tends to be shitty in some way or another, just less shitty than whatever you're coping with, and if so you should of course work on making it healthier. I'm just wondering how you'd make that particular coping method healthier, if that makes sense.

...do non-offending pedophilic people actually say shit like that? wow. I haven't seen anyone doing that, at least not in so many words, but that's... pretty transparently a threat when it's framed like that. people asking for asspats because they're non-offenders would be shitty too, but I also haven't seen anyone doing that, either. speaking generally, though, I think not lumping non-offending pedophiles in with actual child molesters is a good idea, in that 1) it prevents over-generalization, which I think is essential (cf. the not dismissing people thing) and 2) yeah, having an accessible support network of therapists, etc. could help people help themselves, so to speak, and stop crimes from being committed. but that phrasing. no.

yeah, it's not a good umbrella term because of the whole reclaimed-slur thing, buttttt on the other hand, it's seven syllables shorter than LGBTQIA+ and doesn't invite acronym slapfights, so. personally I think it's the best umbrella term out there, so I use it, but it's really context-sensitive? like, I don't use it outside of queer spaces, because the layperson might think it's a slur but okay to use and thereby hurt someone. then again, like you said, there are people in queer spaces who don't like to be called queer, so. it's definitely sensitive, but I guess they'd have to let me know so I could stop using it around them, since that wouldn't be my default. (please tell me if it bothers you, btw.) I definitely don't apply it to specific people unless they use it for themselves, although I might call myself queer (in a general sense, it's not really an important label to me) and refer to the queer community. that would just be rude. (...also, Los Angeles is sort of a queer mecca? didn't know that, I thought San Francisco was the Californian hotspot.)

it... deteriorated, imo. I still admire Hussie's worldbuilding and characters, but I think the storyline got the best of him. fanfic is better!!1!!!1

 

LA has West Hollywood which is a famous gay mecca. WeHo is known for two things, its Jewish people and its gay people. There's many other queer identities that show up there of course. Though in my experience what people recognize it as is "Gay land, also there's lots of Jewish people".

 

That being said I don't have much else to say until points are clarified upon. Things are much too vague. Mostly for the reasons stated by ep.

 

I'm Australian and in Australia and like, people generally say queer, or LGBT(Q)I+. I like queer because I can actually pronounce it, and it makes it much easier to say, "Im queer," than, "I'm a lesbian but my partner turned out to be a dude so I have a boyfriend, but I'm still a lesbian, fight me." Groups run by young people tend to go with queer, while more ~official~ groups or government-thingies use whatever acronym is currently in fashion (which right now is LGBT(Q)I+, tho sometimes just LGBT).

People from my mum's generation are more likely to view queer as a slur, but it's almost always just an identifier for younger people. Thats not to say I dont see older people using it, too.

I definitely also think queer is a better umbrella term, because you can actually fucking say it and no one gets mad that you didn't tack on their letter. But if someone tells me they don't like it, well I'm not gonna use it for them because that's a dick move.

 

Ok, so here begins Discussion. Before starting: I will probably not be able to give dictionary-style definitions for particular terms, because they're fairly abstract and depend on a variety of factors imo, but I'll try to at least explain. Secondly, in the case of there being a lot of response to this, I'm gonna ask that if the thread goes more than two pages without a response from me, please stop responding and give me a chance to catch up.

This particular one was inspired more by a recent facebook gripe than Kintsugi, but a general impression I've gotten from Kintsugi is: kink is beyond criticism. There are some kinks I think are inherently harmful, like racial fetishization/raceplay.

Essentially I think it's important to build awareness, like you said, and sometimes to avoid certain media (not to avoid anything anyone's ever criticized, because that's impossible, but...to be conscious of the good vs the bad, I suppose, and to be aware of who your money/views/what have you is going to.) Example: I think JonTron can be pretty funny. I was subscribed to his YT channel for a few years. At this point, I've had to unsubscribe because he's essentially announced his support of the alt-right. I can't in good conscience give him my views or ad revenue, even though he makes funny videos.

Typically fetishization of gay/bi men is more evident in areas of fandom dominated by women, and fetishization of gay/bi women is evident in areas of fandom as well as in the mainstream. Necessary clarification before proceeding: I don't think women shipping men is inherently fetishistic, and I don't think men shipping women is inherently fetishistic. I think a focus on content that relies heavily on themes of nonconsent is usually fetishistic. I think a lot of A/B/O verse-type fics are fetishistic. I think the line surrounding what constitutes fetishizing can be blurry, but it's a combination of content and attitudes.

Varies. Imo it includes jokes (white people jokes, down with cis, etc.) to requests like asking men not to interact with a blog centered around gay/bi women, to...general wariness around members of oppressor groups. In an ideal world? Wouldn't happen, because oppressor classes and oppression wouldn't be a thing.

I am, in general, extremely wary of the way this site interacts with NPD. I see a lot of armchair diagnosis thrown around, coupled with a lot of posts about how NPD isn't inherently evil ending up in tumblr.txt as examples of Peak NPD, the narcissist emoji...I don't think I really see much differentiation here between narcissist as a term and a diagnosis (and the appropriateness/usefulness of narcissist as a general term is questionable to me.)

Largely I'm talking about that, because that comes up frequently here. I'm also talking about IRL kink practices (ageplay, incest play, nonconsent, etc.) I think these things can function as a coping mechanism; they can help people deal with shitty things and possibly prevent something shittier from happening. I don't think that makes them inherently good, harmless, or a good long-term solution. I also think it's wildly inappropriate to recommend them as a cure. I have no idea if it was a user here or not (it was someone I followed back when I was a big Seebs fan, but I can't remember their url anymore) who received an ask from someone saying they were starting to come to terms with some past sexual assault. The user's first recommendation was that they seek out some fic about rape or abuse in order to process it. That is...horrifying to me, frankly, in hindsight.
My own experience with 'dark' fic as a form of coping: possibly helpful at one point during processing, did a lot of damage to me regarding my attitudes towards sex, consent, and boundaries, and led to a lot of self-harm through deliberate retraumatization.

That is the underlying message in the majority of 'MAP' blogs I've seen; usually not in those exact words, but that's what it comes down to. I also have a hard time trying to name a 'MAP' who has not at some point consumed real child porn, assaulted a child, exchanged nudes with or sexted a child, or isn't currently in contact with 'pro-contact' pedophiles.

I don't think there is a perfect umbrella term. I typically just go with LGBT or LGBT+. Queer doesn't bother me personally; I'm less bothered by the word queer than I am by people insisting I HAVE to be ok with the word queer. I do know a lot of people, typically on the older or younger sides, who are sensitive to the word, so I try to avoid it as an umbrella term.

I never really got that far, it didn't hold my interest, but I inevitably absorbed some knowledge via fandom osmosis.

 

I've not gotten this impression, myself. Granted, I'm one of the kinky people on the forum and I'm one of the ones with some of the incredibly fucked up kinks. Kink is definitely not beyond criticism, however, some of the things that I've seen labeled as inherently harmful are not, I think, inherently harmful. Rape kinks, raceplay, and generally anything that involves triggering traumas is up there in my category "acceptable". Can those things be done poorly? Oh, certainly. That is where I think things need to be criticized. Not in the kinks themselves existing. It's more a matter of "Are you safely managing and practicing this?" Which is a very tricky situation, and it's hardly one that kinksters aren't aware of or don't talk about.

I simply want to clarify that even if I get off on the idea of having transphobic bullshit thrown at me, I don't think that kink is entirely beyond criticism. Just my issue is more the how it is done, and not what is being done.