Shitposting Rave OOC Content Controversy

Discussion in 'It's Galley's Turn' started by cleverThylacine, Mar 25, 2017.

  1. Codeless

    Codeless Cheshire Cat

    I have not said a word about any hypothetical teenage self. I have repeatedly mentioned not wanting to talk over the head of the real teenager who posts in the SPR.
     
    • Like x 1
  2. Petra

    Petra space case

    And like, you want to know the thing I'm really mad about? It's me putting in a lot of effort to talk to you calmly about this about your concerns because you are allowed to have concerns and then get

    thrown back in my face, because not only does it come off as you not making the effort to connect with me like I'm making to connect with you, it comes off as you belittling the effort I put in. And that's probably a me problem!
     
    • Like x 1
  3. shmeed

    shmeed plant me

    i feel belittled too

    i got really upset when you told me i was sex repulsed because 1) i'm not 2) that's not for you to say and seems like an insult

    im not engaging calmly and im leaving

    i still think youre cool petra but i have hurt feelings and stuff

    sorry for upsetting you
     
    • Like x 1
  4. Petra

    Petra space case

    I misremembered and thought you HAD said you were sex-repulsed before. I'm sorry.
     
  5. swirlingflight

    swirlingflight inane analysis and story spinning is my passion

    I'm not feeling offended that you've raised a matter that matters to you. It's less offence and more that the manner in which you've raised and repeated it is one that puts me, and I suspect others, on the defensive in a way that interferes with our ability to hear the gist of what you're saying. Once it becomes "we shouldn't because it's wrong," about a thing we've already been doing? Well, that sets off all kinds of anxious guilt spirals.

    I got pretty alarmed when CT raised the question to FL, because I thought to myself, "shit, are we being too permissive? I gotta think about this, and reference the forum's standards on nsfw stuff." By my measure, things didn't really go down yesterday so much as a flag for a future conversation went up. CT noticed a thing that was distressing, asked whether she correctly interpreted what was happening, and clarified in some detail why she thought of it and why it upset her. I stated I wasn't planning to say more on the matter until FL got back with an answer about whether ooc discomfort is a thing.

    I'm an adult, with the experience and legal responsibilities that go with it. So yeah, now the question's been raised as to whether we've been lax in our methods for making the thread accessible for those who --- for whatever reason --- don't want to be exposed to sexual content don't have to be. And that's a question I need to work on, as the defacto mod of the thread. It's one I value input on, since multiple perspectives = fewer blindspots. It's a good question to raise. It's a good question to think about.

    The main reason I didn't come up with an answer yesterday and talk over people is that I don't want to rush to a solution so I can get past my fear and discomfort quickly. Too quick solutions that causes more problems aren't really solutions. And, believe me, I've been worrying about this. Guilt and shame spirals make for "protect the children" kinds of infantalizing rules, and I don't want that. Free promiscuity causes a lot of unnecessary discomfort for people, and I don't want that either. The notion of a NSFW thread got shelved, but not completely dismissed, because there was never enough interest or preference for it for me to make one.

    I mean, there's a degree to which, even if all the teenagers in the thread agree that they're fine with the stuff that's been posted in here, the fact remains that at least one person here isn't comfortable. Given the high rate of anxiety among people in the forum, where there's one who says a thing, there's probably a couple more who've been afraid to say the thing.

    I just want to think, and talk about the benefits and disadvantages, the ways that various things are accessibility obstacles for all of us who participate in here, before ruling that anything should be done.
     
    • Like x 3
  6. cleverThylacine

    cleverThylacine cuddles for the weird and the fierce

    Please do not go all sanctimonious on me because I am asking a minor who plays:
    • characters who are sexually aggressive
    • characters who engage in fade-to-blacks here more than I ever have
    • at least one character who threw a fit because another character who his character had fooled around with had started fooling around with mine
    • characters who harass people, and
    • characters who are violent both to people and to animals
    to give me a freaking hint as to where their boundaries are. It's a valid fucking question.

    I don't want to have to assume that everything ANYONE, regardless of age, says in character reflects their actual feelings out of character.

    FL is 14, not 6, and does not play characters who do not engage in sexual or kinky behaviour themselves.
     
    • Like x 2
  7. cleverThylacine

    cleverThylacine cuddles for the weird and the fierce

    I haven't said a word about my hypothetical ACTUAL teenage self because she wrote and sought out dirtier material than anything that's EVER been posted in here.

    The person who recommended that I read Kushiel's Dart was 15. And...Kushiel's Dart is a professionally published book that a teenager can buy without being carded.

    Teenagers are not a monolithic group of individuals with the same level of discomfort regarding sexual material, and @seed, if you're not a teenager and you're upset, why don't you just say so?

    Because I am a lot more willing to change my behaviour because someone (of any age) says to me "I'm upset" than I am to do it "for the children" especially when the "children" in question has a record of saying and doing things in the SPR that I find upsetting myself, okay?

    Also I fail to understand how a cat pointing out that the most dangerous thing about sex (or any close physical contact) with her is her claws rather than any other imagined anatomical weirdness is kinky. All 5 ends of a cat are sharp, this is a science fact.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2017
    • Like x 2
  8. cleverThylacine

    cleverThylacine cuddles for the weird and the fierce

    I am so sorry that nearly ruined your honeymoon!
     
  9. Ipuntya

    Ipuntya your purple friend

    personally, i don't see the merit of actually splitting the spr, so much as creating an overflow thread for fade-to-blacks and other 18+ content to run alongside the spr. and i really do think that people are starting to really push it with the nsfw stuff.

    @cryptoThelematrix if my understanding of the way john tends to work is correct, the chances of him responding to this have been pretty slim ever since the discussion started off on such a confrontational note. there's a fairly reasonable chance he isn't going to respond at all. i think i also have a good idea of what the explanation is for the way he roleplays, but i'm not gonna offer it for him without his permission, especially considering how it gets into some personal stuff

    but speaking as someone who really hates ic occ, the response feels more like it's motivated by separate personal issues, and is disproportionate to what isn't even confirmed to actually be ic ooc

    as for john: since you manage to hate private messages even more than i do, you're welcome to shoot me an ask on tumblr or whatever you're comfortable with if there's anything you'd like to say
     
    • Like x 2
  10. cleverThylacine

    cleverThylacine cuddles for the weird and the fierce

    I don't care why FL roleplays the way he does. That's his business. I bring it up only for 2 reasons:

    1) so people can understand why I might be confused about what will and won't bother him
    2) so people can understand that this person does RP stuff that might bother other people themselves.

    All he needs to do is say "x, y and z do bother me even though a, b, and c do not" OR "that was just Kankri being Kankri etc" and we're cool.

    I'm a little cheesed that it's perfectly okay for my character to describe exactly how she would like to murder someone (which she in fact did) but not for her to explain how her species' anatomy works, and I'm super cheesed that "we wear claw caps so we don't hurt people" was parsed as kink discussion, but I'll live.

    I mean: https://www.softpaws.com/soft-paws-cats/ seriously?

    I thought the point of fading to black was so that we didn't have to have another forum.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2017
    • Like x 2
  11. cleverThylacine

    cleverThylacine cuddles for the weird and the fierce

    I think there's a difference between a 5 year old and a teenager, and that you can't control who sees anything in a forum that's not locked down, and I don't want the internet to be a place where kids can't find sexual information if they want and need it because G-d knows you can't trust parents and teachers to provide it.

    So yeah we have a fundamental disagreement.
     
    • Like x 1
  12. cleverThylacine

    cleverThylacine cuddles for the weird and the fierce

    wait, what?

    My RP has its own subforum and we have a thread for NSFW material that is separate from the other threads, if you are going to propose separation of RP forums please leave my already carefully structured RP subforum out of it. It's not like anyone who isn't specifically interested in Weirdmageddon Tango needs to go there.
     
  13. Aondeug

    Aondeug Cringe Annoying Ass Female Lobster

    They want a separate shitpost thread that is explicitly nsfw, ct. It was misworded.

    Anyway that said, I'm not spoilering anything.
     
    • Like x 2
  14. swirlingflight

    swirlingflight inane analysis and story spinning is my passion

    That's the kind of second thread I've ever had in mind. Not a detached rave with a second plot, just a nsfw derail location.



    Since (until very recently) I haven't heard requests for somewhere to bring the fades to black to, or for us to more strongly filter the content in the thread, it's been a shelved idea.

    Plus it's not a solution to one of the big questions we're demonstrating now, which is where to draw the line. The standards used by American film makers, or whoever does the actual rating, is one possible option. I don't highly regard those standards because they are extremely inconsistent and incoherent.

    (Eta reworded for clarity)
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2017
    • Like x 3
  15. Mendacity

    Mendacity I’m meaner than my demons

    Nah it was partially me too, it was just silly all around tbh
     
    • Like x 1
  16. IvyLB

    IvyLB Hardcore Vigilante Gay Chicken Facilitator

    Personally I don't particularly care for an 18+ rave offshot (and let's please go back to seperating 18+ and nsfw out from eachother it's bothering me when they're used interchangeably) since tbh most of y'all are strangers and I won't rp any smut with you without keeping tabs on how comfy everyone is. I have played out a few fades to black - in a discord chat with someone I have written smut with before. Like no offense, but no one is actually obligated to follow up on a fade to black, that's a bonus if you click with the other party well enough that that sounds like fun and I personally am worried the idea of "take 18+ stuff over to the Fade To Black Rave" would create a feeling of obligation that I am uncomfy with -shrug-
     
    • Like x 7
  17. swirlingflight

    swirlingflight inane analysis and story spinning is my passion

    I can promise to try to remember to. I'm so used to using nsfw as a lazy catch-all for anything sexually 18+ that I'll slip up sometimes.
     
    • Like x 2
  18. unknownanonymous

    unknownanonymous i am inimitable, i am an original|18+

    yeah, oftentimes, when characters say/do nsfw things, fade to blacks happen and whatnot, no one is actually planning on carrying them all the way to 18+. like, yeah, if the interaction is between two adult players' characters and the players want to play it out, it can go that far, somewhere else, but that's not always how it goes.
     
    • Like x 1
  19. swirlingflight

    swirlingflight inane analysis and story spinning is my passion

    There's some play on words here about how noodle incidents can be more fun anyway, but I'm not awake enough to make it.
     
    • Like x 2
  20. TwoBrokenMirrors

    TwoBrokenMirrors Succulent Vex Belly

    i mean. thirding the whole 'I never thought fade to blacks were meant to be played out anyway' thing
    People are welcome to message me to ask if I want to play them but I'm likely to say no unless it's someone I already know because frankly rping sex with a stranger is often as awkward as actually having sex with a stranger when it comes to working out likes and dislikes and shizzle, and I already have a friend who more than meets my desired sexy rp quota on the regular.
    Plus I wouldn't want it to be in a public thread anyway. The closest to rping sex in a public thread I'm happy to get is in a closed rp space like Dramatis Transformae.

    On the wider problem- I'm happy to spoiler or dodge talk of genitals in a sex context (since spoilering stuff like 'suck my dick' in an angry insult context just strikes me as absurd) and I'm also quite happy to try and tone down flirting and stuff although that will probably lead to a lot MORE fade to blacks but I'm hazy on the boundaries. Like. To take an example from Pollux and Integritas lately:
    Polly: Yeah, y'd've been inna alley with an asshole thirty seconds later. -griiiins-
    Teggy: Instead I was in an alley with you. And in a public bathroom. And a taxi. And then your flat.
    Is this appropriate? It's not explicit. It's heavily implied, and it would be hard to read it in a non-sexual context, but you could say they were just talking, or making out at the most. But does the fact that it's meant to be sexual make it inappropriate despite the fact that nothing in the words is either nsfw OR 18+?

    ETA: Polly is mine and Teggy is @IvyLB 's so I'm not dragging anyone else into this, no.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2017
    • Like x 6
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