Weird Question(s) About Kintsugi

Discussion in 'General Advice' started by unknownanonymous, Apr 14, 2015.

?

Non-seebs followers and people that invited friends to Kintsugi, how'd it go?

  1. Awesome!

    4 vote(s)
    44.4%
  2. A bit better than good

    2 vote(s)
    22.2%
  3. Good

    2 vote(s)
    22.2%
  4. A bit worse than good

    1 vote(s)
    11.1%
  5. Horrible!

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Wiwaxia

    Wiwaxia problematic taxon

    "doooooo eeeeeet"

    At least that's the impression I've been getting from lurking around seebs's blog of late.
     
    • Like x 5
  2. Mala

    Mala Well-Known Member

    @littlemissCodeless You have exactly described my reaction to sjw stuff thank you for that. I keep trying to hit that no fucks given about sjws point, but I end up being an ass and pissing off people I like instead. And also my anxiety kicks in because I secretly give all the fucks. So I've had to settle for not saying anything so I don't end up harming myself or others.

    On the thread topic, the week the forum started I had a friend staying with me so naturally she ended up joining. I'm a little surprised she didn't go "stop talking about the seebs forum already" XD
     
    • Like x 1
  3. pixels

    pixels hiatus / only back to vent

    I'm a non-seebs. (seebs intimidates the shit out of me tbh) @ADigitalMagician is why I'm here. I haven't run a personal blog on Tumblr for maybe a year and a half. This place is a lot saner for hashing out viewpoints, unlearning prejudices, idk it's just a lot more navel-gazey and the nature of a forum with threads and topics keeps everything neat too. There's less knee-jerk reactions, I can say that much. And the self-selection means that people are willing to listen, which is great. Idk it just seems like people actually care here about what their words mean and do. I can't really describe it.
     
    • Like x 4
  4. a tiny mushroom

    a tiny mushroom the tiniest

    I started reading Seeb's blog because my partner said that they had a lot of cool stuff to say. At first I was like, "Eeeeeeeh," because I was very in the EVERYTHING IS MORALLY ABSOLUTE AND PEOPLE WHO SAY SJW ARE IDIOTS WHO HATE MINORITIES sorta mindset because everyone else was in that sorta mindset and even though I kinda disagreed, I felt like I wasn't allowed to disagree without being a Bad Person, and Seebs seemed to not be in the same mindset so I had a sorta knee-jerk reaction. But then I saw Seebs say something that was anti-doxxing, and that being needlessly aggressive and hateful is not actually a positive thing, and I was like, "Actually I agree. No one else agrees with me about this, so I am a bad person. But Seebs agrees. Hmm," so I decided to read more of Seebs's blog and uh here I am! Although I have a lot of trouble reading their blog 'cause there are so many words and the formatting kinda confuses me and my brain fritzes.

    Also @pixels I also find Seebs intimidating, even though they have been pretty nice when I have submitted stuff to them! I can't tell when they're being sarcastic or joking, I think is the problem.

    But yeah, I feel like here I can say things like, "Shouting at people and being really mean is generally not an effective tool for getting people to agree with you", and I can disagree with other people, or other people can disagree with me, and that doesn't make me a bad person who needs to die or go live in a rubbish bin.

    So yay!
     
    • Like x 2
  5. unknownanonymous

    unknownanonymous i am inimitable, i am an original|18+

    that is really helpful, thank you!

    and i have a feeling your first paragraph is basically what seebs and me were talking about, with how Getting Off Tumblr And Into Somewhere That Encourages Actual Discussion helps. :D 'cause yeah, i think i discovered seebs (or rediscovered him, i'm not sure) just when i was starting to feel like something wasn't right with tumblr social justice. and i was wondering if it made me, like, scum or something - if i just did not care enough about oppressed people. so like, seeing seebs, seeing how he responded to me and other people, seeing the good arguments us seebslings make for our positions...

    after that, i stopped worrying, "am i a horrible person 'cause i disagree with sjw stuff? do i just not get it?" and started worrying, "what the hell would happen if tumblr knew that i disagree with some of its popular positions?"
    which might not sound like an improvement but... i have a pretty severe anxiety problem so i'd always be worrying about something, anyway. so... it's more of an improvement that you might think. and i have a place to vent and that is WONDERFUL!
     
  6. hoarmurath

    hoarmurath Thor's Hammer

    Became disillusioned with tumblr last year, quit in november, felt the best I've felt in a long time. Sort of nudged two good friends to look at tumblr more critically too. One of them ended up here, and I showed up once she told me about this place.

    I don't feel like this is an echo chamber, and I've found it very nice to know that I am not the only person who has deep problems with most of the "social justice" which is pretty much just people being shitty to other people but using activist language to do it. I used to reblog lots of sj stuff too, up to thousands of reblogs (wtf self), but it was making me a worse person. I was beginning to treat people in my offline life as bigots I needed to defeat or some such, even if they just had differing opinions about interrogating texts or how tied authors are to them. I still get this "ugh what fucking shit" feeling when I see people liking stuff I know is deeply problematic and liking celebs whom I know have done terrible shitty things, but the point is that it's not as important. It's not my business to go laying down the law about who's allowed to like what.

    My country is not America. I can't treat it as America.

    Also I began to resent to being told off countless times about how we're all crackers and terrible people, and it's like, excuse me, my practically entirely white nation lived in serfhood for about 700 years under other white people! And being an Eastern European country puts us still at somewhat acceptable white but not quite because we're not Western European.

    It's the lack of nuance that keeps ticking me off these days.

    Also the fact that if I had continued reblogging and so on, I would have become one of those people who terrorises others. I can't do reasonable activism. Either it's angry cruel hater or it's nothing.

    I also have anxiety, so.

    PS. Do note these are pretty much the same problems I had with reddit. They're both fucking toxic.
     
    • Like x 2
  7. albedo

    albedo metasperg

    Slightly longer answer, in case it makes you feel more comfortable:

    Go for it. This is not a secret forum, and we're not gatekeeping; you don't need personal connections or minority status to join. If they don't enjoy it, no hard feelings; nobody's likely to yell at them for having Wrong Thoughts. Differing opinions are interesting.
     
    • Like x 2
  8. pixels

    pixels hiatus / only back to vent

    I don't even go to reddit because I think it might be the "last" place on the internet where someone might still call me a c*nt for having an opinion. I never even thought about the issue of tumblr being so toxic that it becomes us-vs.-them. Part of it, I think, is that if you disagree with someone on tumblr you are a Bad Person, rather than... well, disagreeing. Here I can disagree with people without being (or feeling) attacked.
     
    • Like x 2
  9. seebs

    seebs Benevolent Dictator

    It is sort of weird to me that people find me intimidating. Although I guess not entirely. But it's weird to me because I'm generally not really hostile or anything. On the other hand, I can be sudden and hard to predict and fairly forceful.

    If you have trouble telling when I'm being sarcastic or joking, feel free to ask for clarifications on what I meant by stuff, I will generally be receptive to that. I have too much experience with not being sure how to understand a thing to be a jerk about that, generally.
     
    • Like x 3
  10. hoarmurath

    hoarmurath Thor's Hammer

    I became so disillusioned and disgusted with reddit I cannot even handle going on subreddits that are meant for information and not for people showing how shitty and awful they are. No idea why I even held out so long.

    And yes, you are correct. Disagreeing on tumblr, you suck. Especially if you disagree with someone marginalised in any way. I generally kept to myself and rarely commented because anxiety, but my heart always skipped when I saw something in my askbox. :( Ugh.

    Seebs, I am also a fairly forceful person in real life, and people do find me intimidating a lot. Which is funny because I am a short fat hobbit. Short fat hobbits are generally not intimidating. On the internet it comes down to writing style a lot.
     
  11. albedo

    albedo metasperg

    @seebs I think that part of it comes from the fact that as someone who's older and someone who's often answering questions, you tend to read as an Authority Figure, particularly in your own space.

    Part of it may come from the autistic thing. Your reading of conversations and events isn't always the allistic-normative one, which can make you read as unpredictable, which can be intimidating for people because they fear a negative response. Whenever people break with social norms, many people will be intimidated because 'if you don't respect this norm, what OTHER norms do you ignore?'.

    The autistic thing also seems to contribute to the way you interact with famous / popular people. You don't show them deference or act like you're unworthy of interaction with them - e.g., you interact with Diane Duane, just making conversation, in much the same way you'd interact with anyone else. You're implicitly saying that you're just as good and important as those good, important people. That's non-normative and implies authority, again, I think. Tumblr kinda functions on a weird popularity-based social hierarchy, as far as I can tell.

    Part of it may come from the fact that you're fairly blunt about your flaws and lack of empathy. People tend to be intimidated by things like 'I am not a good person, I enjoy breaking things', both because being willing to admit to flaws is non-normative, and because so many folks are convinced they are The Worst Person Ever and therefore legitimately deserve your wrath, even when it's rarely true. Amusingly, I think that's also why so many people want to send you anon asks and the like, because if you're more interested in truth than making people feel better, they can trust that you'll be accurate to the best of your ability.

    Um, sperging, hopefully not annoying. Some of this may be obvious, I just figured completeness would be most sensible, rather than eliding things that seemed obvious but might not be.
     
    • Like x 6
  12. pixels

    pixels hiatus / only back to vent

    @seebs I value your opinions highly, I want your good opinion, and I'm scared I'm not going to get it. Which is silly, but try telling that to my self-esteem.
     
  13. Codeless

    Codeless Cheshire Cat

    Fun story: I first contacted seebs, (as opposed to seebs contacting me, which happened beforehand,) because vastderp mostly, and he and jesse partially were involved in Drama that I felt desperate to add information to.
    However, vastderp, to me, passes intimidating and lands firmly and flat out scary, and I had noticed that seebs was always very calm and reasonable debating with people, even people who were being very offensive, so I went on anon and explained myself to seebs and we talked some.
    It should be noted that I am a bit statusblind, and on the other hand very easy to intimidate.
     
  14. TwoBrokenMirrors

    TwoBrokenMirrors Succulent Vex Belly

    Oh yeah this is me also, heh
    Am still kind of intimidated by seebs on occasion despite having exchanged a fair amount of correspondence. Other times am entirely confident. Thus is my wildly vacillating nature.
    My trouble, though, is mostly that I tend to decide that I like people and want to be friends, and then I get hung up on trying to be friends, and it never works properly, probably mostly because the people I decide that I want to be friends with seem to never be people I actually should be friends with- the real friends have all turned up entirely by accident.
    And I can't handle disagreement like at all, which is stupid because there's nothing in my history to cause it.

    On a more relevant-to-the topic note, I did invite a friend to the forum for the purposes of discussing brain- and genderweirds but I don't think they've joined and i don't know if they will, though they seemed to find it interesting. I kind of hope they do. =/
     
  15. seebs

    seebs Benevolent Dictator

    I only sporadically even have experiences that map usefully onto "good opinion" or "bad opinion", mostly I just think people are entirely too vast to categorize. That, and my memory is so ridiculously shoddy that I end up not sure who I'm talking to anyway.
     
  16. Morven

    Morven In darkness be the sound and light

    @seebs, honestly I don't find you intimidating in the least, but we're kinda the same age and stuff and I think that makes a big difference. And I did my Internet growing up back when the place was small and everyone talked to everyone.

    I suspect I did come across you through seeing something you posted @ Diane Duane, though; I've followed her on various things since forever, though I never read her Young Wizards stuff; I'm an old fan of her Tale Of Five series from way-back, the everyone-is-bi-and-poly fantasy series.
     
    • Like x 1
  17. unknownanonymous

    unknownanonymous i am inimitable, i am an original|18+

    @seebs i don't find you intimidating. never have. i dunno why. i think it's that i like the things that make you "alien" or whatever, and like... just, i've never met anyone else that so... seebsy. and i actually find you more predictable than i do most people. 'cause you're always so chill, and i know how you came to your general principles. that those principles are more the result of reason and logic than How You Happen To Feel At Any Given Time. that you're good 'cause you choose to be, not 'cause doing bad stuff makes you feel bad. and you take critique. you also welcome weird-ass personal shit without judgement. and i do pretty well at picking when people are joking on the internet. and i like you being blunt about your flaws and stuff.

    like, my mental seebs-prediction algorithm runs really fucking well, and explains your behaviour - when i don't anticipate it - really well.

    heck, i sometimes flat-out wanna be you. i mean, i can't and who i am is pretty great, but... damn, you're Good.

    also i'm not intimidated really by @vastderp either, 'cause even though he is more aggressive, there is a clear pattern to it. a pattern which essentially is: if you're not an asshole, you don't fuck with his boundaries, don't do horrible sjw activism, don't do anon hate and/or you don't crash into his plastic owl when you see your pet sj issue, he is nice to you. if you are an asshole, you fuck with his boundaries, do horrible sjw activism, send anon hate and/or crash into his plastic owl when you see your pet sj issue, the gloves come the fuck off.

    and it doesn't occur to me to be intimidated by @jacktrash, frankly. it's easy to see that he cares about people, loves @seebs, and while he does criticize sjws, he does it a lot less and with less aggressiveness than @vastderp - but more than @seebs. also, even if i didn't know much about him, it's pretty clear to me that @seebs would choose a good husband. :D yeah. jesse is the fluffy one, kinda.

    that and you three put together make the perfect team, like kirk, bones and spock. with seebs as spock, vastderp as bones, and jesse as kirk, of course. yeah. you round down each other's rough edges and make a whole bigger than your parts.
     
    • Like x 4
  18. kmoss

    kmoss Under Construction

    mm. samesies. yes to everything you just said.

    this crew has made me a much more rational person and way better about not jumping on weird tumblr bandwagons

    and also self care actually. I can only hope i develop an in person friend group like that someday

    (I mean, when I get feedback from that group in general, I get a bit flaily and my roommate has to live with "omg people I look up to and respect on the internet *talked* to me" but I am getting better at not being weird about it)
     
    • Like x 2
  19. unknownanonymous

    unknownanonymous i am inimitable, i am an original|18+

    me too. in-person and/or on the net, really.
     
    • Like x 2
  20. seebs

    seebs Benevolent Dictator

    I was pretty happy to find Diane Duane on tumblr, she's pretty cool.

    It's always weird to me when people admire me or hate me. Like, either way, I am my frame of reference so I am by definition the neutral point, so strong reactions to me are confusing.
     
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